this show is brought to you by safety Eyes streaming now on safety FM dot life Hello and welcome to another episode of the J. Allen Show. Today is Tuesday, May the 12th. Hopefully, you had a fantastic weekend and things were good in your neck of the woods. That's for here. It's safety FM. We're having a fantastic time. Thank you for all the great feedback about Episode 1 20 Safety FM radio Big addition. That was a fun one to Dio. I really do appreciate you guys enjoying some of the music choices and some of the four match that was actually there.  Thank you for taking the time on Friday to come out and take a listen. So as a for today's episode is gonna be an interesting wing today. Have the opportunity of speaking to Caleb Welsh? He is the business development director at Avatar Management Services, so this gentleman works worn organization but doesn't pretty interesting things when it comes to driver safety. But he also has a very similar background when it comes out of the whole world of radio. In television, he's recently started a podcast called Safety Rocks.  This was one of the reasons why I want to bring Caleb, I I really think you're gonna enjoy what he has to say today. Take a listen to the conversation between Caleb in I here on the J. Allen Joe, and let's get you started down that sequence now. Well, good. I appreciate your taking the time to do this because I know that I kind of called you right out of the out of the blue ones was like, Hey, how about you? Come on. And you have no clue what I'm going to talk to you about it.  Most people are always, like already couldn't ask me, and you'd even go down that path, which I really love. When people do that, I guess it's because I will. That's my background. Like communications, radio, TV. I'm cools it, so I'll just I'll run with it. Whatever you throw at me. Uh oh, really? OK, you for bank account numbers to start off. Well, OK, let's Let's be clear. I'll answer questions. But I might deviate the details depending on what that question is. OK, that makes sense. And well, I have to tell you, I have actually interacted with Avatar for quite a period of time, man.  I'm trying to look back now. I want to say it's been years. I want to say it. Probably close to a decade at this point. So I was very excited when I heard that there are Podcast is coming out. And then, of course, you came into the picture, which I thought was fantastic. And I started taking a look and was like, I want to know more about Caleb s. So there's looking down the path. I was like, OK, so Caleb's there, And how does this whole thing start?  How does how do you go to this safety world? I mean, I see that you have a very diverse background. So that is how does the world of safety trigger you all of a sudden in the month of October of 2019? So the way it worked was, um, I was in a couple different positions throughout retail, and ah did sales managers, positions and membership, acquisitions and retention. And I was looking for something local moving back to Canton from Dayton, Ohio, and I got into a couple of retail boxes, but it just I was kind of over it.  I had done retail long enough that I wanted to change. So I found a local company here in Canton that was doing B two B lead generation. You would hold specific accounts with specific clients, and you would do lead generation for that company in their in their specific industry. Right? And so I met Avatar as my first client with that company. So I was actually third party provider for Avatar running sales, and Derek and I met, and he trained me on what it is that they sell, what the industry looks like and who were targeting.  And I was going after deals for them. And our relationship grew while I was at that company so well. And I was so successful that he's like, Hey, I need to learn more about what it is you're doing because this is working and we love it. Great. So we kept a line of communication open, and in that organization that I was working for, I slowly started to move up the ranks. And so I ended up being the business development executive for the entire group that was doing lead generation.  So I ended up then being the person that managed the client. So Derek and his relationship just grew even further because now I'm in charge of the program. I'm coming up with the strategies I'm building the content that we're doing on a multi channel approach. And, uh, Derek and I just always had that relationship. And then I decided to make a change from that to moving into a little bit of a different field. And, um, during that time, Derek and I kept talking and I said, Hey, you know, just so you know, if you guys that you know are looking to do something internal, I've always loved what you guys do.  I had a blast working on it. Um, just let me know. And I guess it was right place, right time. They're called me and said, Hey, I'm ready to move. Let's talk And ah, the rest is history. I've been at Avatar since, so I've kind of known them and worked for them in a couple different ways. And now I'm internal Well, in The funny part is, don't tell Derek that I like because I really do like him. But he's one of those guys that I don't think he's ever met a stranger, if that makes sense.  Oh, it does. It totally doesn't. You're right. You're 100% accurate. I mean, he had, I mean, and I'm he doesn't come across his sales you And that's the other fun part. Not trying to, you know, to go down. This is a weird path here, but Derek is one of those guys that is so approachable when you actually get to know him. I mean, I remember meeting. I've met him over the phone originally, and we had developed such a relationship that I almost felt like he was a close friend.  That's how he comes across its it it's true. Um, that day I met him, he came to our organization to train me. Um, he brought all the material and a power point slide. And it was within five minutes, you would have thought we were best friends. I mean, even even mice like my managers at the time, because again, this was very, very beginning to me. Starting This is my first big account, you know, and I'm gonna this I'm gonna set me free. Hey, this is your client.  You're gonna handle it. and Derek and I sat in a room for three hours, and it was like we knew each other for years and we're just always had that relationship. So he has. He has a great capability of doing that, which is something else that I love. It's one of those things that not everyone has, and I don't call it a magic trick, but it's definitely a great skill set on how he does that. So as you'll start well, taking a look at the self that avatars doing and of course, you already involved for years before you actually step in the door as quote unquote an employee A Z, you're looking at this.  How do you go? OK, I've done the retail stuff. I've done the acquisition stuff, the also the retention portion. When it comes to memberships, how does this all of a sudden *** safety is the way that I want to go now with my career? I mean, I know you're enjoying the relationship with Derek, and he's a kind of open up to some things with you. So holidays sudden, do you ***? This makes sense to me to do business development worship. I guess really? The world of safety. Yeah, it wasn't.  I mean, don't get me wrong. Safety is important. But it was Don't let it go. Answer. Come on. I I I used to do retail to I mean, and I was actually even at one of the big red boxes that you're at at one. Yeah, it's like Circuit City. Yeah, absolutely. Before they crashed. Yes. I mean, I was actually under the market that was going to change the whole thing. I mean, you know how that worked out in all seriousness, though. But I will tell you before, I really started taking big, deep dives into safety.  Yeah, I knew it was there, but it was I won't say that. That was like, Oh, everything revolved around safety. And I'm not saying that everybody has the same mentality, but I don't think that everybody takes the approach of safety once you kind of start getting into it, as you probably do now compared to what you were doing in the past. And this is using You mean you know, an opinion. So Tiu leek steering to the right direction here. So it wasn't It wasn't about safety. It was about sales they needed.  They needed to sell a product that that teaches safety, that teaches how to change behaviors that helps adults learn differently. And I'm intrigued by that. I'm intrigued by always playing Devil's Advocate, always being someone on the other side. So when it comes to adults, we're stuck in our ways right in our products, specifically teaches how to change behaviors of employees and in in return, your company becomes more safe. You are a safer organization when you use the training methods and the theories that we bring to the table.  So they needed somebody to sell that, and I had already been selling a form of that. Now they just have a better product. Over the years after, I had been working for them as 1/3 party and they said, Hey, listen, we need somebody that knows how to bring in a sale strategy and knows how to put these things to together. You were running an entire division for industries across the board. It wasn't just safety. I was running programs for energy companies and programs for retailers and programs for bankers, and Avatar just happened to land in that wheelhouse.  when I got started. And so for me, it wasn't It wasn't originally about safety. It was about you guys need a sales guy, and you need somebody that knows how to set up a program and help it grow. That's where I fit in. And I already loved the relationship. Once I met the CEO Mark Gardner, it was a done deal. He It's funny because we just talked about this, but I fell in love with a company that cares about people more than they care about a profit in the sense that obviously a company has to make money.  But if you've met Derek, if you've met Mark, you are a person first and then a business asset second, and there's not many companies left out there that function that way. So when I say it wasn't about safety, it's not. It's not that political answer. It's not. It was time for a change. It was Day One. I met Derek when I was 1/3 party guy that was going to do sales for him and fell in love with the company and who they are and what they represent. And when they called me to ask me to be internal.  It was a no brainer. Bob Edwards on the line, and I want him to share some of the classes that he has going on. We started doing some of our human and organisational performance and morning trading using virtual platform, and we had a request to do one for the Asia Pacific time zone. So we're putting one together. It may, but the 1st 22 hour sessions will be hot fundamentals, and the way we set it up for the virtual is we go over each of the five principles, and we talk about the basic sort of assumptions that humans have around those by principles.  That session, which is 22 hour sessions, is about learning teams. It's about operational learning specifically around morning. So that's the two classes. We did break it up into 42 hour sessions, but that's what. So just to reiterate with Bob was saying That's hop training available between nine and 11 GMT. Time plus eight. That's nine and 11 GMT. Time plus eight session one will be on made the 18th and 19th. This will be hot Fundamentals session to May 20th and 21st about learning teams. For more information, go to hop hub dot org's four slash live dash virtual.  That's hop hub dot org's ford slash live dash Virtual. Thank you for listening to safety FM. We are here to help you in this time of need. Make sure to join us on Patri on Ford slash Safety of em and we are back on the J. Allen Show on Safety FM. So what's going to start going down the path there? So you get there, you fall in love, your liking what you're doing. So now we're talking a few months in at this particular portion. Now, let's get until roughly about March of this year, and now we're starting to see a lot of things related to covert 19.  What kind of impact that had on you? Well, for us, it keeps it hasn't affected us from a I guess from a current business standpoint, new businesses, different right? Current business is all about how do we help you guys get through this? Because our our clients, our customers are essential workers there. The truck drivers, they're the they're the transportation industry that's delivering the things that people need, right now, and so they have to stay open. Therefore, we need to stay open because our tools and our training and everything that we offer to our current clients and customers are still in play.  They're not shutting down there. In fact, growing. They're looking for more drivers because restrictions have been lifted in, things have changed for them. They can't hold their quarterly or monthly or even weekly safety meetings in person anymore because of social distancing. So for us, it's Hey, we have all these online tools. We know of training that can be sent out that self directed. You don't have to be in a classroom setting like you used to, and we can assist you in staying open. So for us, it's been a great thing for new clients is where it affected us, right?  We're not the aggressive, normal type of business that you see when it comes to big box or corporate America, if you will. You and I have been in that spot before. You're a number, or you they may know your name. No, that's not how we operate. I'm not gonna call new prospects and say Hey, by my stuff, I know there's something's going on that's affecting the whole world. I don't care. We went a different route, and that's how we operate. And it's all about Let's step together.  Let's figure out how we can support one another and here's what we're going to do to in order to help you. And if you're interested, take advantage of it. If you're not no big deal, we'll talk later. But I think you'll find value in what we have to offer. And it really didn't change a whole lot. It just changed how we market and brand what it is that we actually do. So do you see any kind of changes in technology on how things air delivered? So I know that one particular portion idols were delivered via DVD.  So are you seeing? And then and it went into the LMS side. Are you seeing things being different? Are, is anybody requesting anything out of the ordinary like maybe webinars like live of any type of features or anything along those lines? Or is business as usual? Um, it's a combination of both businesses as usual, because we've been serving all of our stuff online through an LMS where in fact, our offer right now out on the table is that we're offering our LMS for free for 60 days for anybody that needs it in this interim, because we don't know when we're gonna come out of it.  We just know we're gonna come out of it. But to go back to the other portion of that is that it's still business as usual because a lot of people have some form of online communication with their employees. To what extent? And do they have a library of training and materials? Maybe they do. Maybe they don't. That's where we can help. But it's a combination of both. We got out of the DVDs. We went into the online, and it is changing for people. There's a lot of people that are so used to using paper now they don't know what is out there were with the way the technology has changed were the ones that can offer that change.  We can say, Hey, here's what we do. Here's how we can deliver it and we can have you up and running in 24 hours. Would that help you during this time to communicate with your team and make sure that safety stays is a priority for you. So how did it work out at the very beginning, especially with Ohio having some of the words of one of the first actually states that have some of the biggest restrictions in place in regards of really not going into work. Unless you were an essential worker.  How did that work out for you? Where you're doing a lot of things from home in that particular time? Or how did that come about? Yeah, actually, everything. Everything for us has been at home. I haven't been in the office even wants since March 22nd whenever this thing came out. Um, so I've done everything from home. I have a home set up. I have access to all the things that I need. We can deliver everything digitally, uh, from contracts to our actual training and access to our elements.  So for me, nothing's really changed. Outside of from a sales perspective, it's it's different, right? And the reason the podcast came about was because, Well, if we're not gonna be aggressive and I'm not out there making a ton of cold calls and I'm not going after people aggressively. What can I do to make sure that people know that we're here to help? But I'm also not a pushy sales guy. And that's where the podcast kind of came into play, delivering episodes that explain who we are and what we do, what we offer and just talking about the general rule of thumb in the transportation when it comes to defensive driving, when it comes to training and education, and that's where we that's where we I guess we flourish because we're able to say, Hey, we're not calling you insane by our product.  We're out here just trying to send out tips and tricks, things that you guys can do from home because we know that you're restricted. Take a look at what we do. We're gonna give you some free access to it for 60 days so that you can have this and try it. And then from there, my job is to have those conversations with people that are interested, and I walk them through the process. So let me ask a strange question there. So when you decided to come up with the podcast, how are you thinking you're going to be able to market this at the time because, let's let's be real.  There's been tons of podcast that have come out as of late. So how do you know that all of a sudden, people are going to be able to find you unless they're looking for Avatar? How does that come about where you go? Okay. This is gonna be our best solution for the time being. So how does this come about? I don't know that it's our I don't I wouldn't say it's my It's my number one plan. I would say it's a part of our multi channel approach.  Um, the way that I work sales is in correlation to understanding that nobody lives in one channel. Um, email has become the new direct mail 25 years ago. Um, and it's inundated. People have just a ton of emails, so it probably gets thrown in the trash. But if if you live with the email, the phone call a social media touch some length in posts that also include that social media touch, maybe some Facebook ads and you have a podcast, you have a better likeliness that someone's going to find you on one of those channels and driving them to the podcast where they don't have to deal with me cold, calling them and interrupting their day.  But they can listen to what it is that I do, what it is that our company can offer to them what it is that avatar has on the table. That's where the podcast kind of came about was this is the perfect time to let people come to us through our multi channel approach. Without it aggressive sales, um, approach. I guess it. It's the best word I can say. Well, I have heard that robo calling the thing to I mean, you could add that into your chain. Yeah.  No, I I've been in that world. The elite generation company I was in Part of that business was telemarketing to some degree in a different area that I did not work in. And I'm the guy that blocks those calls to, and we know that that's annoying. So ah, lot of the cold calls. When I make it, our they're directed their targeted. They're very specific. I've done my research. I don't make a call without at least knowing something about the company and whether or not I'm a good fit, um, the biggest mistake salespeople make is they think that everybody needs their product.  And although that's a great theory for a business, you want everyone to buy your product. It's not sustainable, it's not. It's not something that is repeatable and that grows your company, because when you think that everybody needs your product, you've missed the idea of what you're supposed to be doing. Our job, our our motto, it avatar is we're making the world a safer place. We want to make the world a safer place. I can't make the world a safer place if you don't like what we do or it's not a focus, and I cant change your mind on that.  So I need to find the people out there that are always striving to put safety first. And those are the people that I want to talk to you. Hey, I don't care if you buy my product or not. I want to know what you're doing to make the world a safer place because that's our number one goal. If you have that same interest, then I probably have something that could assist whatever efforts you already have in place. Please. J. Allen Show At Hop University. We cut the bull out of human and organisational performance training.  We were born out of Necessity way. Hear it all the time. Human organization performance courses are expensive and hard to find. Safety classes put me to sleep. Help. So we did. We offer on demand high quality online courses in human and organisational performance, safety and leadership all in by season safety and hot practitioners. No need to schedule time for that conference. No need to track down the latest guru and no stuffy classroom required. Join us today at hot university dot org's. That's H o p university dot RG. So have I told you about this one?  I know that this one's actually coming up this week. So Sheldon Prime is from the safety consultant podcast. Abbey Ferry from the Safety Justice League are going to be doing something special in a little intimate on Thursday, May the 14th at 7 p.m. And e hs. Look at reopening America's workplaces isn't be a live virtual roundtable discussion. A livestream in Audio on Safety FM also will be doing a video stream as well on Safety FM and dot t be people that are going to be doing the round table Children Prime is host of the safety consultant podcast Abbey Ferry from the Safety Justice League.  Kevin Yarbrough, former OSHA area assistant director. Jake Wolf in Dean Summits Safety Group. So if you do get an opportunity, tune in on Thursday, May the 14th Live at 7 p.m. Eastern time streaming on safety FM dot com in safety FM dot live. That's the audio version or you go to safety FM dot tv. Now keep in mind that we do have some chad boxes available there so you can interact with the box. We can go back and forth, have some conversations and see what we can come up with anyways.  Thank you for always being the best part of safety FM, and that's the listener. See you then. May 14th 7 PM Thank you for listening to Safety FM. We are here to help you in this time of need. Make sure to join us on patriotic Ford slash Safety of em and we are back on the J. Allen show on Safety FM Well, and it's interesting that that's the approach, because let's be really when it comes to certain sales, people have mostly like, Oh, no, no, no. We have to push it, whatever, whatever form that you can.  So it's good to hear. Or it's refreshing to hear that you're not going through every channel and that your are realizing that certain channels are not the best way to go about it. Because I'll tell you, I hate robo calls. I also hate people sending me stuff on messengers to give me an ad like this, and you have a link in connection. You get jammed up with all my guide. Here is this very long message of everything that I sell, and this is what my brother size underwear is at the same time to.  It's like I don't need that kind of information exactly. And you're not wrong there, Jay, Um, I get it, too. You somebody connects with me on linked in, and you think that it's just like, oh, they must have seen something they liked and I connect with them, and the next thing you know, it's a page pitch on what they sell to me, and I'm going that's that's not the way you should operate. If you want my attention, make it short and sweet. Tell me what the pitches.  And if I'm interested, I'm gonna dive into your website. I'm gonna see what information you have. I'm going to research it. Then I'll reach out. And I realized that early on in the B two b lead generation side of things, that that's how people by now and and we have to watch for buying signals. And we have to be cautious. And so when I came to Avatar and we started talking about what they've tried them past versus what's gonna work now, you know, there's no there's no magic to it.  There's no silver bullet on this. Everybody buys differently. But if you if you sell with the right attitude and the right approach, they're not buying your product, they're buying you. They believe in what you believe in. You find the people that have the same passions is you, and that's something that you can't teach. Um, you either have passion for what you do or you don't. You're probably the good example, J. You're very good at what you do. You have a passion to speak and talk and share ideas and opinions and reach an audience when you love what you do, It's not a job.  And literally my last episode of our podcast with Derrick is gonna be about an hour and 1/2. I haven't launched yet, but this is what we talked about was, It's not a job when you love what you do. And that's that's the key part of all of this. No, absolutely. I agree with you 100% and thanks for making that particular reference. Now I have to ask you, though, if you don't mind, you took us such a different approach when you actually started the podcast because you took the approach of the podcast of actually taking deep dives with the people that you work with, which is very uncommon for something that's actually released to the general public.  You almost the A person with something that would be normally released internally inside of a company. So why did you decide to go down this particular path opposed to doing what other people do, and just either do like a sales pitch that that's what the marketing department wants for the podcast to be. Why did you decide to go with Let's go with back stories in exactly what the people do inside of the organization, especially for something that you're releasing into the public. Sure, so there's there's two things with that, but I'm gonna be fully transparent.  Never done a podcast before, uh, went to school for radio and TV, and I've listened to a few that I enjoy, but a podcast is semi knew me. There were two thoughts Behind it, though, is one from the research that I've I found and I could be wrong. So because again, I'm I'm new. Um, people buy into a character they buy into a host. They buy into the person speaking, Um, I have a good buddy of mine that listens to a lot of podcasts, and the first thing he said was there are times that the shows I like talk about things I have no interest in.  And I listen to every single minute of that podcast because I like the person. So my first thought was OK, how do I get people to fall in love with who we are as an organization? They need to know who our people are. Sure, it's great internally to talk about some of the things maybe we have or dive into those backstories. But if people don't know who we are and how and why we operate, what gives them the urge to listen to the next episode? The second thought was, How do I prove that were subject matter experts and really do have all of our ducks in a row and know what we're talking about if I don't give you the background of how things have started, how we came about and what we've done for other people along the way.  And so those were the two thoughts that I had to kind of say, even if it's a short, very first part of our series. As I dive into this and learn more as I go, I want people to know that what we're going to cover and what we're going to talk about. The subject topics that are gonna be brought up on our podcast actually have weight to them. I need them to know how they came about what we do to fete them and know that thes thes theories or these techniques work was to just go.  Okay, let's just talk to each person and organization and show what it is that their their job is. What is their role? How do they come into play in Avatar when you engage with us? And that was that was really where I started? Well, the interesting part you is that if the same, for instance, when you have some of the clients that are taking a listen, you should almost even plug what actual episodes or content there, the people that you're talking to are in. I think that they might get a kick out of that of a guy has been in this.  Derek was in this. If you look at this particular post because I think that it's something that's interesting, because you don't always know here talking to you that's on the other on the other side of the line or who you're emailing back and forth with. So at least that actually does some association between the name and the face. Yeah, I don't want to give any Don't give any spoilers out, but, um, I'm calling it Siri's two of the podcast. When we come out there's gonna be and I'm gonna be adding an extra segment that's really gonna hit home with, um, something's out there.  I'll be talking about it, probably in the next couple weeks, releasing some of that information. But we're going to do some extra segments. We are going to dive in a little deeper. We're gonna actually bring on some of our current clients and not just the VPs or the people that we deal with. We're gonna bring on some of the people that have been through this training on a personal level and talk about the experiences they have. So without giving away too much, you're absolutely right. We want to get into that realm and start doing that.  But again, I wanted to set the podcast up for anybody that wanted to know who we are and what we do to prove that we also know what we're talking about. I wanted them to have that information. I think it gives us more of a personal touch than most people are willing to go after. So let me ask this couple strange things here. Why did you decide to go with season? Opposes just straight up episodes. I know that some people do the seasons. Why did you decide to go with that again?  I because I'm new. It was all about I mean it for me. It's trial and error, right? I don't I don't know what I'm doing. Some to some degree, and I'm more than doing club. I have no clue what I'm doing. It right is doing Yeah, So I went You know what? I know a lot of people call a season a whole year, but I thought you know what? What? What's it gonna hurt? I'm gonna give you a quick six or seven episode Informational. Here's who Avatar is here.  The people that work for Avatar let you hear who we are in the back stories. How we got to the positions were all in and then I'm going to go into now. Let's talk about the product. Let's talk about real people using the product. And I felt like that needed a big separation. So I went with Okay, Season one is who we are, what we dio. It's a It's a summary with some detail and makes us the subject matter experts. Season two. And whatever it comes after that is gonna be.  Let's talk to everybody out there using it. Let's talk about other safety issues. Let's talk about people that are using some things that we don't necessarily have right off the bat. Um, we do a lot of different things, and we work in a lot of different ways. It's our main focus is defensive driving and safety. But we've done things for OSHA regulations and other parts of the safety world that we have. I pee on. We have ways to deliver it, but it's not as refined because those air custom projects.  If I want somebody to be interested in that, I've got to start explaining how we've done that with other companies, which is why I felt like here's the background of how we got to where we're at now. Let me show you how we can fit to almost any safety need and talk about where that lands everybody and and find out what people are doing out there that is working and what they're doing out there that needs help, And can we be the person that helps? Maybe we can't, but that goes back to I will tell you if I don't feel we can help you that you're not a good fit for us.  That's okay with me. And there's not too many sales people out there that do that. No, no, no, no. Most people do not take that approach whatsoever. It's that commission or how I can close a sale. That's really the important part, is normally what it boils down to. I appreciate you actually being that honest about it because most people wouldn't be. Now, let me ask this because going into the podcasting world is much different. That actually being in the broadcast world, Yes, with your background in broadcasting.  How have you enjoyed this process so far? Because there's some differentials there on how you do the broadcast to composed to how you do a podcast. So are you enjoying the process? I I am absolutely in love with this. Um, you know, when you goto I guess when you make decisions like I did, which was I don't know that I want to go to a four year college. I don't know what I want to study, but I do know that I really enjoy communications, and I really enjoy radio.  Um, which was my main focus. I mean, we did some TV stuff. Um, you know, we did newscasts and different things we had to put together for projects, but I really fell in love with the radio side of things. You think about what that path looks like. And let's just let's just cut it all down. You're gonna be somebody's, you know, go for for a couple of years, if not longer, oun. So PG. That's not what came to mind when you were about to say, we're going.  I know you're gonna be somebody's go for. You're gonna be getting coffee. You're gonna be putting in a bunch of time. So maybe land what? The midnight show or the early morning show that nobody's listening to. And by the time you've put in 89 10 12 sometimes even longer years of that work you might land yourself in a decent pain, morning show or drive time show. And as much as I loved that, I just didn't know if I wanted to stick with it that long to get where that would land you.  So the quick answer was okay. You're good at communications. You're good at talking to people can you sell? And I quickly found out that I could, so I jumped into retail. Retail pays you well because they take your soul because you're hours suck you in the new new more than radio jobs. Let's be real here because when it comes to actual retail, you still have to jump from market to market. If you really want to make it up in that retail world, if you really want to go up most of those most of those past inside a retail and that's no different than how it is in radio and radio.  You normally would have to go from one market for maybe being the midnight guys. You're saying to maybe moving up to doing maybe the mid the mid day shift and you have to jump from market to market and be willing to move. Which I think retail has ah lot to do with that same market style. And I will tell you I have probably meant mawr dish jockeys when I was in my retail career than what I have actually had at radio station. Those people that were all I used to be the secretary or the assistant and I moved up.  And now I'm about now I'm doing the on the air stuff. It was like, What? What just happened here? Yeah, that's very confusing to, because that's I noticed that in the industry you're not wrong. I go wait. You mean that isn't what you were planning to do your entire life like you just you fell into the How does that work and why is that happening? But to your point about retail being the same, I think you're right. It absolutely our wise and market wise. You're bouncing around.  I think the biggest difference, though, is and maybe times have changed since I was really looking into the industry. But I believe that retail will just pay you more because there's more profitability depending on the company you're working for. So what's the easier answer? Make more money and have the same type of schedule or buster buster chops and grind for 15 plus years to make what you could make almost starting out retail. That's where those decisions probably make a big difference. What's winning that you say that that's almost exactly what I ran into.  I was actually working retail. Still going to school. Teoh become a broadcaster, Quote unquote. And I was offered a job in a different market, making less money than what I was making in retail. And I was like, Now I'm not gonna do that. And I waited several years before I jumped into it full time because I was so hesitant about Oh, the money is not going to match. But that was just my idea of doing that at the time. Yeah, that's that's exactly my point is I got offered.  I was 21 I got offered a management position in a big retail store, Um, one of the largest out there and the money compared to radio. Even if I were to land, let's say, Ah, morning show was almost equivalent and I went, I'm 21 I already have the opportunity to make that same amount of money versus a A you know, five plus year grind to get where I want to be on the radio side. I'll just stick with retail for now. And outside of the hours, there wasn't much difference except the money.  So I I went after the money, Of course, Now would I make the same decision again? I don't know. I probably a but at the end of the day, I I still loved what I did. I got to interact with people on a daily basis. I got to communicate. I learned a lot, and I think that everything happens for a reason. So I'm where I'm at because of those experiences. So I don't know that I would change it, but you're definitely on point. There it I did the same thing you did, which was No, I'm not traveling across the country for what I could make year if not Mawr doing what I'm doing.  Well, then I ended up taking the stupid path and actually started moving around for retail. So that's a whole other story. Make that very long and drawn out. So how so Right now, what aspect are you in love with the most with this whole thing with Avatar? I mean, what is it that you wake up every day and you go? This is what I want to accomplish because I like X so much. Um, I believe full heartedly. This is how I've treated retail. And I think it's the other reason why didn't move the way I wanted to move in retail, So it's gonna sound like a cliche answer.  But I promise you, it is literally the truth. My number one goal in life and who I am as a person is to help others. I maybe to my own fault sometimes. But my my goal is I want to help people and what avatar does and how they do it is exactly what I fell in love with. There are people out there trying to build a better safety culture, trying to do things, to make sure that employees arrived back home to their families, every single knife, safely unharmed, without accidents, without any injuries without costing the company money.  And we are able to do that. Um, I we have a number that we can actually count, but there's probably thousands more out there that we can't. But Avatar, over the course of their existence, has helped save over a 1,000,000 lives. To me, that's the most important key factor versus anything that I can sell you anything that I can dio and in retail I felt like I was always helping somebody, so I don't get me wrong. I enjoyed what I did, but this brought it to a whole nother level.  I mean, I felt like I'm actually making a difference. Every day I wake up by making the call to say, Hey, I know things might not be going the way you want. You might be seen a high accident. You know, frequency. You might be seen some cost of loss on on the back end of your P NL. What if I told you I could help you save 20% of that? What if I told you we can make sure that your people get home safe for every night that you don't have to deal with some of these things to me?  That is the reason behind what? Ideo? I'm helping save lives. And I'm helping companies become more safe. More, I guess people aware of what's out there, what's going on. And that's where I live, man. Now a lot of people want to know more about you and the podcast working. They go, they can go to avatar m s dot com. We have all of our safety rocks podcasts right there on our website. But if you wanted to find it on Spotify or Apple podcast. You can find safety rocks there as well.  Each episode has all my contact information, but for anybody wanting to get a hold of me, it's See Welch at avatar m s dot com. Well, I appreciate you coming on to the show today, J Thanks so much for having me it really appreciate it. I hope you have a great day and I'd like to do it again sometime. Well, thank you for taking another listen of the J. Allen show. Thank you for always being the greatest part of safety FM. And that is the listener. I want to thank some of the special people out there that wanted it all and also known as our executive producers here on the J. Allen show.  Like to think Alex V. Lexie K. Mercedes s Steve W. Glenn A. Ralph L. And David M. Thank you for your contributions and really giving some direction to what? The shows that sound like we'll be back with another episode of the J. Allen show before Too long. Good bye for now. Once more of the J. Allen show dog home. The views and opinions expressed on this podcast or those of the host and its guest, and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the company.  Examples of analysis discussed within with podcast are only example. It's not be utilized in the real world at the only solution available as they're based only on very limited. Undated Open source information. Assumptions made within this analysis or not reflective of the position of the company. No part of this podcast may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system or transmitted in any form or by any means mechanical Elektronik, recording or otherwise, without prior written permission of the creator of the podcast, J. Allen.