Melbourne’s Property Power Couple on Subdividing and Conquering

In this episode, they display their approachable and warm personalities that have helped them to become the successful team they are today. Designer Rebecca and builder Alfie share how they built their strong work ethics from early ages, how they both ended up in careers they never expected, and just how it all came full circle in the end.

Timestamps:
00:52 | Awaiting Her Prince
04:59 | Discipline Inspiration
07:23 | Running the Business
14:54 | Role Models and Coming Full Circle
18:19 | Believe in Yourself
21:13 | Country Roots
23:13 | Celebrating Tradies
27:17 | Strong Values
00:51 | Start ‘Em Early
04:23 | Get Your Thinking Caps On

Resources and Links:

Transcript:
Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:01:58] And then in comes my dad who's all about property and taught me a lot about what I know now. And together with my parents, I bought my first investment in my early 20s. And it was an apartment, it was in a really great area. And that was my first taste of the industry.

**INTRO MUSIC**

Tyrone Shum:

This is Property Investory where we talk to successful property investors to find out more about their stories, mindset and strategies.

I’m Tyrone Shum and in this episode we’re speaking with Rebecca and Alfie Cardamone, the dynamic property development duo from Victoria. With Rebecca as the interior designer and Alfie as the builder, this husband and wife team behind iSubdivide have working together down to a fine art as they subdivide and conquer all across Melbourne.

**END INTRO MUSIC**

**START BACKGROUND MUSIC**

Awaiting Her Prince

Tyrone Shum:

When it comes to property power couples, Rebecca and Alfie Cardamone are at the top of the list. Together they combine their family values and passion for design and development to live out their dream while creating dream homes for others. Despite their work seeming like they’ve been doing it their whole lives, it’s somewhat of a second career for Rebecca.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:00:52] I guess I got into property in my early to mid 20s. I have an Italian background. So I had the typical European parents that want you to invest in property. And that was whether you're a boy or a girl.

[00:00:39] My mum always used to say to me, 'Save your money, and buy yourself a house'. And I used to say, 'No, Mum, I'm gonna marry rich. Do you know what I mean? Like, my husband is going to buy the property, I didn't have to worry about any of that'.

[00:00:50] So I carried that on. I had my part time job in school, as most people do. And I would spend all my money. And then I got to, I guess, my early 20s. And I'm like, 'Okay, so the rich husband's not here yet, maybe I should have listened to my mum'.

[00:01:36] I grew up with having a really great role model. My mum was a really hard worker. She would work from early in the morning to late at night, and she would save all their money. And that was what I was seeing every day. And that gave me my urge to figure out what I wanted to do to make money and save money.

[00:02:19] I grew up also reading Steve McKnight books and everything like that. So back then, without knowing too much, I knew I wanted to acquire a lot. That I wanted to have something behind me, not buy and sell or not invest in shares. None of that interested me. I wanted to kind of build something.

[00:02:41] From there, straight after school, I did marketing. And I did marketing up until probably my mid 20s, or 'till after I met my husband. And then through our love of property together, I decided I wanted to change careers and bring something professional to our team, because we were developing together. And I wanted to do something that was actually going to add value and save us money.

[00:03:12] So I went to school. I left my career in marketing, and I went to school, and I started from scratch at about 27. And I started building design. And from there, now when we do projects together, I'm able to do the drawings, save us money there.

[00:03:29] What we found is really great is working together as a builder and a designer. We can sit on my software and work out the best ways to design a house that's going to give us the most value. And that's something that you can't really do all the time with another company. And that's something great that we share that we can sit there and go through and figure out how we can get an extra bedroom in, or how we can make the most of this block. And I think that's one of the ways that we add value.

[00:04:01] I guess that's sort of my journey in a nutshell of how I got into it from being young to meeting my husband, hearing he was a builder, and that we were going to do stuff together. And then I kind of jumped. I've just really poured myself into the industry now and I've got my own interior design business, but our projects take up a lot of our time. So that's where we're working the most, it's on our own.

Discipline Inspiration

Tyrone Shum:

Alfie Cardamone was born in Melbourne, though his parents moved the family to a country town when he was just a year old. He returned to Melbourne in his early teens, where he began to realise he didn’t quite fit the mold that his family had set out for him.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:04:59] My father always wanted me to be an accountant. So I finished year 12, went to uni to study accounting, and it wasn't for me. So the first six months, I sort of just knew it wasn't for me. So I went and did an apprenticeship in Brick Lane, because I've got four uncles that are bricklayers. And so I went with them and [planned to] keep the family tradition, I was thinking.

[00:05:27] They're quite tough. In terms of, you know, there's no smoko, you work, and that's it. There's no ifs or buts about it, no phone calls. Get on the trough and lay bricks, that's what your job is.

Tyrone Shum:

[00:05:39] That's tough.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:05:41] It instilled a good discipline in me. And it was something that I use now. And then doing my apprenticeship in my late teens, early 20s, working also a second job in a restaurant as a waiter [and] pizza maker. So that sort of just kept the hard work going through, because I was always saving money for a home.

[00:06:10] [At] 21 [I] bought my first property. And just always wanted to be a builder. On the job site, seeing the builder come with his doughnuts [having] a beautiful time and in his beautiful car. And I'm thinking, 'Man, I'd rather do that'.

[00:06:30] I always wanted to learn how to get to that level. And [in my] early 20s, I did night school to get the qualifications to become a builder. So [I was] working during the day, at nights, working on the weekends at the pizza joint. And during the week I was at night school, just trying to be a builder.

[00:06:51] So it was always something that I wanted to do and then [I] eventually got my license and then started working for a developer. [I] did my own projects, and I'm at this point where I've gone the whole roller coaster. But it's been worth it.

Running the Business

Tyrone Shum:

As husband and wife, parents to two young children, and business partners, you may think they see each other 24/7. However, when it comes to business they do work on projects together, but they’re lucky to spot each other during work days.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:07:23] We're both working on a project at the moment together. So we've got a one year old and a three year old. So our day starts very early. But we're lucky in the way that we do a lot together, but we have separate responsibilities.

[00:07:38] So we'll definitely start the day together, get our kids ready, get them off to childcare or their grandparents'. And then I will either work from home and work on my design projects, arranging stuff for site and Alf does a lot of the hands on stuff on site.

[00:08:00] We develop a lot in regional areas. So it's a long drive. So he'll be out there on days that I can't go out and do all the stuff hands on. And I do a lot of the design work, interiors, picking materials, project managing it.

[00:08:18] But there's nothing that I won't do or he won't do. We get involved in each other's stuff when we have to as well. But day to day, it's more hands on on site.

[00:08:28] I guess we're not your typical developers, because some developers would have to hire everyone, whereas we do the work as well. So we're both [inaudible], which is great because we make more money. But it's gonna be more responsibility, more work. And I guess the fact that we have to spend a lot of our day doing it, we can't go and do another job, like, this is it for us. And that's the life we've created. And that's what we intended to create as well. [It] was to be able to do this full time.

Tyrone Shum:

They both have a lot of control over their business, which ensures they get the most value out of each project. However, they also rely on the professionals when it comes to areas outside of their expertise.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:09:25] We work really close with a real estate agent in the area that we're developing at the moment, who is in contact with us all the time about what we're doing, how many rooms we're doing, what materials are we using, what looks great in the area at the moment. And the fact that we can change things at any time we want and we can have that hands on control, without spending money, like without paying a designer to redesign or doing variations with the builder, we'll just do everything ourselves.

[00:09:57] And I guess that's the way that we've learnt as a couple we have that power. That's our edge over, or our way to make more money than another property developer is the fact that our hands on skills give us that extra value.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:10:13] And even just with that, as well, it's the money factor, but there's also the time factor. And obviously, time is money. And now with the whole COVID scenario, a lot of consultants have lost staff, and they're way behind. So it gives us the ability to fast track it a lot sooner than if we were to get an external consultant. And you're chasing them, because they might be [short staffed]. And so that's where the benefit is from that perspective, as well. So, it has its challenges, but it definitely has its benefits.

Tyrone Shum:

[00:10:52] That's great. And Alfie, what do you play? What role do you play in the business as well within the project?

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:10:58] I'm on site most of the time, so I'm dealing with trades, suppliers. Especially in Victoria at the moment, there's a lot of challenges with suppliers, with materials and shortages in certain products in the industry. So that always throws a few curveballs.

[00:11:19] There's also sort of a challenge in the labour market at the moment. So [being] on site keeps me on my toes at the moment. And there's also a couple projects that I do for clients at the moment. So that's also something that I'm dealing with clients externally as well.

[00:11:39] There's two projects at the moment that I'm working on for them. A two unit site and a three unit site. So it's on site mostly at the moment. And I deal with a lot of the council requests or building surveyor, ongoing things. There's always something to do.

Tyrone Shum:

They manage both their own projects and client projects in perfect harmony, which they pride themselves on.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:12:12] Alf and I have a business together called iSubdivide. So we get, essentially— and this is where I come into it again, with the design— but we get the town planning and subdivision permits for clients. So if they're wanting to develop, we arrange all that from beginning to end for them.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:12:37] So that's something that also keeps us on our toes. So we also offer that service to our clients. And that's sort of separate to my construction business. But that's also something that Bec and I, we have a focus on a daily business. Because we usually get a couple people always inquiring daily for plans and permits, because the market is quite hot at the minute in terms of that.

Tyrone Shum:

Their style of subdividing is less about scaffolding and bricks and more about examining and shuffling papers, which is just the way they like it.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:13:37] And we want to business as well that is remote. It is very time consuming, and can be at times very stressful building all the time. So while we are, as I explained earlier, doing everything hands on ourselves, it's because we're at a young age, we want to make the most money we can while we're building for our future.

[00:13:58] But the idea of iSubdivide is to give people the same opportunities we're creating for ourselves, but without us having to do the hands on build.

[00:14:10] It's a great business and we love working on it. And it really brings out the best in both of us in terms of our skill set without having to do that day to day grind of the build.

Tyrone Shum:

[00:14:25] It's always fun to go on a construction site.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:14:28] Ask my husband about me coming to his construction site!

**ADVERTISEMENT**

Tyrone Shum:

Coming up after the break, we take a moment to celebrate the hardworking tradies…

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:23:13] It's so inspiring. Tradies now, like, I really look up to a lot of [them], especially ones that have their own businesses at young ages.

Tyrone Shum:

We delve deeper into how their families have shaped them, and just how soon it started…

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:27:49] I just used to remember him telling me how... he would show me his salary and just be like, 'See, see? If you work really hard and you go to work to do your job right, you'll be there one day too'.

Tyrone Shum:

Alfie reveals just how long it did— or didn’t— take for him to tackle his first development after he bought his first property.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:01:43] That was an achievement at that time for me. And it just kept on going.

Tyrone Shum:

And that’s next. I’m Tyrone Shum and you’re listening to Property Investory.

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Role Models and Coming Full Circle

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca Cardamone, the design half of the iSubdivide duo, is also a proud Melbourne native. Her family and her Italian heritage are just as important to her as her Melbourne roots.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:14:54] I grew up in the northern suburbs of Melbourne. [I] still live in the northern suburbs of Melbourne. As I mentioned before I grew up in an Italian family [and] had a really strong role model in my mother to follow in terms of wanting to work and save money.

[00:15:17] But I've also had my dad and my brothers really interested in property and Steve McKnight. And funnily enough, my older brother used to be a member of Your Investment Property, the magazine that would come monthly. Which, funnily enough, Alf and I ended up being in last year or the year before, which is kind of, like, full circle.

[00:15:46] So I used to see my brother read those magazines, and I was always jumping on. And being so young, I never thought that that would be me in there one day. So I guess I'm kind of proud that that happened, because it's something from my childhood and seeing it growing up.

[00:16:03] My family has always lived in the northern suburbs. So I guess it's something that is another reason we're working so hard. We put everything into property development. We don't have, right now, our ideal family home. As soon as we buy or sell a property to make money, we put it into the next project.

[00:16:24] And I guess at the end of the day, we're doing that because we want to buy freedom. I had the typical upbringing, living in the suburbs, go to uni, get a job, have a family. But I've always had this yearning to want to do something or be something different. Maybe travel more or live in another country. And I guess the only way to get that freedom is to have the finances behind you. That's the only way to achieve that sort of freedom and those sort of choices. So that kind of really drives us.

[00:16:57] And we're in our mid 30s now. If I get there by my 40s, I'll be really, really happy. I'll be really satisfied, because that's definitely what drives me every day, to not settle down in the suburbs. That's not the life that I think I see myself or my family now having.

[00:17:14] Even though I had it growing up, and I loved it and I appreciated that it was very secure and safe and comfortable. But there's just something about it that's not for me. And that's how my husband and I connect as well. He's exactly the same. There's just something more that we feel we're trying to create for our lives. I'm trying to get out of a little bit of the norm and onto something a little bit different.

Believe in Yourself

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca was a self-confessed nerd in high school, which has paid off well in building her strong work ethic that she relies on every day.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:18:19] I used to be on the debate team, and the principal was the coach. So I would say I was a very big nerd. I would get, like, best speaker whenever I was doing debating. I just tried, I guess, but I've always had that. I've always had, like, a strong work ethic. I've always tried really hard.

[00:18:40] And I guess this comes back to my mum again. When I would do something at school, if she would come and watch me debate or she would come and watch— I used to sing, so I would do musicals, [I] used to love singing, my dad would take me [to] singing lessons, dancing lessons, like very really, really supportive parents.

[00:18:57] My mum would always say to me, no matter what I did, if I was singing, dancing, or doing anything, she would always say to me, I was the best. 'You were the best one there! Don't listen to that teacher, you were the best one there'. She always used to say that.

[00:19:09] And it used to stick in me. And I used to think even though I wasn't, back then I would believe it and it would give me so much confidence. I always remember that from school, I always remember Mum saying that.

[00:19:23] So now I try to do it with my kids. Not because I want them to think they're better than everyone else. It's more because I learnt the confidence it gave me. And when you have confidence, you can do anything. Like, you're unstoppable. And that's something that I really want to instill in my kids because I found it really beneficial for myself.

[00:19:40] I remember telling my husband that because I think my son was doing a soccer class and I was like, 'You're the best, you're the best one, Ace, keep going!' And I was like oh my gosh, don't let the other kids hear you say that! I'm like, I'm doing it because he's gonna really think he's the best! And watch him, one day he will be the best.

Country Roots

Tyrone Shum:

As for Alfie, he spent his early years in Terang in country Victoria, where his parents bought and ran a local pub.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:21:13] We stayed there for several years. I don't have huge amounts of memories of that, but photos and just the whole process of being associated to that scene is something that still sticks to my mind.

[00:21:32] We came back to Melbourne, just in Melbourne's northwest again, and school was something that I enjoyed. But there was something that was missing for me at school. I always was involved in the self development side of things. So growing up, in my teens, reading Napoleon Hill Think and Grow Rich was my first book. And I was always just wanting a bit more.

[00:22:03] So after school, I went to uni to fulfill my father's wish. Unfortunately, he didn't get his wish. But I enjoyed the challenge that I had, which was the bricklaying side of things. It was a little bit out of left field for my family. You're supposed to be this educated [person], go to get yourself your degree. And now you want to put the overalls [on] and push wheelbarrows and lay bricks, it's crazy.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:22:37] Some people would see that as you didn't become the success that we wanted for you. You went to school all these years, and now you're doing a trade.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:22:44] And that was probably the reaction probably at that time for my parents. And so I had that challenge, but I had to prove them wrong. And that's something that motivated me as well. So now looking back, you look at tradies now, and you might finish school at say, 18 [or] 19, you do your apprenticeship [for] three [or] four years, and you're on anywhere between $80,000 to $120,000 [annually]. You don't have a HECS bill.

Celebrating Tradies

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:23:13] It's so inspiring. Tradies now, like, I really look up to a lot of [them], especially ones that have their own businesses at young ages. And they're doing extremely well. And they're always booked out, they're always busy. It's really something to look up to.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:23:29] And that's something that's evolving. So now more and more people are looking at it as a real option, rather than going to uni and getting your $50,000 [to] $60,000 plus HECS debt and starting off a wage of $50,000 to $60,000. And just corporate level getting 2% [or] 3% increases every year. It's definitely changing and evolving, the world that we live in.

[00:23:59] So after [that, I] got [my] apprenticeship, and then like I said, I was working also a second job at a pizza restaurant. So earning a bit of cash there and also studying three nights a week at a TAFE, getting my diploma in building and construction. Because that's what I needed to get a builder's registration, or to get to the next level.

[00:24:24] So I did that and worked for a builder and worked for a developer and then just started doing my own projects for clients that I would engage with. And that worked okay. And just wanted a different side.

[00:24:43] COVID taught me to diversify your business to a certain degree, because there are a lot of challenges in the building game. Even today where a lot of builders are under a lot of challenges and stress, and [are] broke, which is sad. And then that affects the clients and the developers.

[00:25:04] So it's a high risk business of that side of things. So diversify, get into something that I'd love to do. There's nothing better, Tyrone, than seeing a block of land with an old house or whatever it is and seeing, you know, 'Yep, I could put four units on it, I could put six on it'.

[00:25:27] And then working on the plans, and then being on site and watching it grow. And then giving the keys to the agent, or the owners, and it's just the whole full circle. And that's what I enjoy [doing]. And it's given me an opportunity to have a level of freedom that probably most [people in their] mid 30s to late 30s don't have.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:25:52] As in day to day freedom.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:25:54] Day to day freedom. And that's something that now iSubdivide gives that opportunity. We're doing stuff for clients, and all that type of stuff. And I enjoy doing that, because especially in these times, you need to have multiple incomes. Having one right now is just... you're too far behind the eight ball, with inflation and everything just going crazy expensive. You definitely need to look at now, 'How do I get multiple incomes?' And that's what I enjoy doing now for people.

Strong Values

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca is as proud of her parents as they are of her, and their strong work ethics have clearly rubbed off on her, just as they hoped they would.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:27:17] My dad works for CitiPower. He's had the same job ever since he was... I don't know, [about] 18. Both my parents were born in Italy. Both came over really young, so English is their second language. They don't have an accent or anything. They've developed their language very well.

[00:227:41] But my dad, I guess [was] probably even younger than 18 when he started with CitiPower. And it's the only job he's ever held, he's had his whole life.

[00:28:02] My mum was a kindergarten teacher.

[00:28:08] She would leave to get there, like, at 7:00 [or] 7:30. Sometimes she'd come home [at] 6:00 [or] 6:30. And then, being the typical Italian mother, she would still do the cooking and the cleaning. So we would all be home at 3:30 [or] 4:00 after school, but we would wait until 6:00 [or] 6:30 for my mum, my poor mum to get home. And she would cook for us.

[00:28:32] My mum came from a family, especially her father, who was very in the building and construction industry. He was a painter, but he would develop units, multi units. And I guess my mum kind of had that... that's where she got the idea of 'Invest in property, invest in property', because her dad taught her that. And then when they got married, her dad let them live in one of his properties.

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca and Alfie’s families have more in common than it would appear. Both of their parents and grandparents had homes in more rural areas, before moving to the outskirts of the city for the lifestyle.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:29:26] And that's kind of something we said that we don't want to sell our properties that are in good areas, because we don't want to make that same mistake. Because we think, 'Oh, imagine [if] our parents still had that house in blah, blah, blah, it would have been worth a fortune'. But they moved out so they could have a house and this giant backyard that they don't use.

[00:29:46] So we kind of always, both of us, had that lesson of 'If we get something in a good area, we're going to try [to] hold on to it. We're not going to sell it. We're not going to do what they did'.

[00:29:57] And I mean, they're happy with their choices, I'm just saying in terms of for our future, we don't want our kids to say, 'Oh, Mum and Dad used to own that property and blah, blah, blah, I can't believe they sold it'.

[00:30:09] So I guess that's something as well that my parents... they won't say it's a lesson, they won't say, 'Don't do what we did'. But it's something that I learnt from them without them telling me. If we have land, we're going to try [to] retain it.

[00:30:24] And we have done our best to hold on to the amount of properties we have. For our age, it's pretty crazy. Like, you would think the level that we've got into at our age, most people would say, 'Why don't you sell some?'

[00:30:39] But our goal has always been for a good retirement. So we're going to hold on to as many as we can. And we will only sell if we have another project and we need to use the money for that next project.

[00:31:29] Alf and I, we sacrifice now. I guess we could be doing a lot more. Like all our wealth, or everything, even our all our days, all our time, everything is put into property. And if we sold everything now, we could have a giant, beautiful home with a pool and a gorgeous car and go on holidays.

[00:31:52] We sacrifice our present for our future. Because if we can come together and build a really strong foundation, then we won't have to worry about much later on in life, as many people do.

[00:32:05] And that's the goal. Like, we're sacrificing our current. And I mean, we still live a great life now. But we don't have, like I said, we don't have our dream family home. And we probably won't for a little while, and we're okay with that. Because we're so headstrong and focused and motivated to create this life for ourselves, at least by our 40s so that we can have that later on. There's plenty of time for that. We're young now. We want to work and we want to build. That's the goal.

Start ‘Em Early

Tyrone Shum:

Alfie’s parents were always involved in property, and after they sold the country pub, they diversified their portfolio by buying several properties. Alfie inherited their work ethic, and started working at a family friend’s pizza shop when he was 14.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:00:51] So while everyone was partying going into Friday night or Saturday nights at high school, I was working. And it was a shock at the start, I hated it.

[00:01:02] But then I just enjoyed it. And I developed social skills that [I'm] benefiting [from] right now, where I can go and talk to anybody, and I can have a really good conversation with business people. Because, a lot of times you get regulars at the pizza shop, and there'll be business meetings there, and you interact. And that was really good.

[00:01:29] So, from 14 I was saving my money, pretty much most of it, if not all of it. And I bought my first house at 21. That was an achievement at that time for me. And it just kept on going. So then I wanted to do a development. And then several years later, I worked away to get a property and put a unit at the back. So that was my first development.

[00:02:00] So that was something that my dad always was helping me with. And until today, he's been very, very, very influential for me and helped me a lot in that regard. Just, you know, mindset. And also, if I need a set of hands, he's the first one to call.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:02:24] He helps us a lot. And I guess that's an inspiration for us as well. He helps us hands on. So get in there, and save money, do things yourself. Don't just always hire people. Like, you can do it. And his dad can do anything. Like, he could build a house from scratch. And if he didn't know how to do something, he'll just go learn how to do it.

[00:02:45] He's told me about courses he's done. Really crazy thing[s] like [a] welding course, I don't know, all these courses. I'm like, 'Why do you need that?' He's like, 'Because [I] needed to fix something. So [I've] gonna learn how to do it'.

[00:02:56] And I guess in a way, we're kind of doing that as well. So I guess that's something that we've taken from your dad. It's just if you've got to do something, save the money and do it yourself. And look it up. So, you know, we could hire a designer and a builder, but we don't. We do it all ourselves.

Tyrone Shum:

[00:03:13] Especially when you've got the skills, you know, you may as well use it.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:03:16] Exactly. Exactly.

Tyrone Shum:

Alfie delves into the story behind the first property he purchased when he was 21 years old, where he started a pattern he continued for over a decade.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:03:34] Up until my early 30s, there was more rent vesting. Where I would buy a property, just for investment purposes. And where I was living, I would rent for example. And the key to success for that is you've obviously got to pick. If you're going to buy a new investment property, it's got to be a property that's going to grow in value, or you're able to add value at a later date, where you [could] profit or you could make some profits that are going to outweigh you buying your family home, sitting on it, paying the mortgage off. And that's something that we did, even when we first started dating, rent vesting, and it worked out quite well for us.

Get Your Thinking Caps On

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:04:23] Alf taught me. When I had met him I had mentioned earlier that apartment with my parents that I bought as my first investment. And he was just like, 'Yeah, no. When you invest, invest in land. Because you need to add value to it. We need to build something on it'.

[00:04:41] That's Alf's mind. He's always thinking, 'Oh, we can knock that down and put four'. 'We can knock that down and put three'.

[00:04:46] So I quickly got rid of my apartment and we used the money elsewhere. Alf will never really buy an apartment or a townhouse, like, he's always looking for land in terms of investing. Because of that [thought that's] always in the back of his mind, 'How am I going to add value?'

[00:05:04] Even if we were to buy a house that we're going to build at the back, we'll still figure out how we can keep that house at the front. Can we get an extra bedroom in it? Should we go up? Like, we will look at every possible option to add value to that land. So when we invest in property, we're not just investing for the sake of investing, we're actually trying to make money off of it. So that's why we're always looking for land.

[00:05:27] Specifically, we do try to find something where— and this is, like, a pattern that we've had— we can build behind an existing house. So that while we're building at the back, we can keep someone renting at the front. Obviously, we reduce the rent. So that we have income coming in while we're building at the back, and then we generally renovate the front house.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:05:50] And subdivide it and sell off.

Tyrone Shum:

The Cardamones clearly aren’t afraid of hard work or a challenge, and they’re not put off by long settlements either. Six to 12 month settlements may not be the norm but they’re not unusual, and they work fine for them.

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:06:21] In that timeframe, we're getting plans and permits. And then once we get that, then just before settlement, or we settle and we sell it prior, or if we have to settle we settle and we'll sell it and we'll make a profit out of that.

[00:06:40] From our perspective, a small deposit of whatever it is, five [or] 10% of the acquisition cost, plus the permit costs has just returned us 100% or 200% return on investment, within 12 months. I mean, that's the sort of thing that we always constantly think about. ‘How can $1 make another 10 cents or 20 cents or 30 cents or another dollar?’ Money's always constantly got to work for you and grow in that sense. Not in a greedy sense, but in a smart sense.

**OUTRO**

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca and Alfie Cardamone’s story continues in the next episode of Property Investory. Rebecca shares one of Alfie’s greatest strengths when it comes to finances…

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:08:22] I just wanted to add that to the whole money aspect, because that's definitely something that I think Alf, especially, is really great at.

Tyrone Shum:

They get into why excuses just don’t cut it anymore…

Alfie Cardamone:

[00:11:24] It's not, 'I live in this suburb, and I'm going to be like that'. No, there's no more excuses for that.

Tyrone Shum:

Rebecca shares some of the best advice she’s ever heard, and shares some of her own.

Rebecca Cardamone:

[00:14:44] Things like that that I learn from other people just always stay in the back of my head day to day.

Tyrone Shum:

And that’s next time on Property Investory.

**END OUTRO**