In this episode, Hague takes you on a thrilling roller coaster ride through the unpredictable terrain of his property development journey. Get ready for a journey defined by tenacity and determination, from overcoming a staggering $100,000 setback on one of his properties to navigating the tumultuous challenges of 2020—bushries, the relentless grip of COVID-19, and market uncertainties. Hague’s remarkable ability to transform adversity into triumph is nothing short of extraordinary, and he unveils the secrets behind his unparalleled achievement. As he shares his incredible journey, Hague imparts insightful advice and knowledge that can benefit individuals, whether they;ve just entered the property world or have been a part of it for years.

Timestamps:
01:04 | Unprecedented Heights Amid Chaos
04:55 | Learning from Losses
11:55 | The Aha Moments that Define Nick Hague’s Path
13:16 | Navigating Transitions
15:36 | Life Beyond the Office 
17:39 | Hagye’s Wisdom to Younger Self
19:45 | In the Shell of Growth
20:48 | The Power of Creation
 
Resources and Links:

 
Transcript:
Nick Hague:  

Vacancy rates went right up aswell. It was really hard to rent the property out. We had to drop our rents consistently to just get tenants in there; the quality of tenants kind of went down as well. 

This is Property Investory where we talk to successful property investors to find out more about their stories, mindset and strategies.

 

I’m Tyrone Shum and in this episode, we’re back with the remarkable Nick Hague, the Business Development Manager at Punters Finance. Hague’s journey mirrors a roller coaster, overcoming the challenges of 2020 and bouncing back from a $100,000 setback on one of his properties. Join us as we explore the determination needed in his remarkable story. 

Tyrone Shum:  

Hague recounts a standout property development triumph amid the tumult of 2020’s COVID-19 and bushfires in Australia, where his project not only weather the storm but ascended to unprecedented heights. 

Nick Hague:   

It was a joint venture in the Southside suburb of Camphill, in Brisbane. We picked that up at [the] end of 2019; I was actually overseas on a family holiday when we settled that one. [I] got back on the first of January 2020, and as we know, COVID was starting to unfold at that point in time. 

Tyrone Shum:  

We had bush fires too. 

Nick Hague:  

What was that, sorry? 

Tyrone Shum: 

We had bushfires as well too.

Bushfires, COVID—we had everything going on. We just [got] on the property and we're like, 'What are you going to do now?', we thought the world was going to fall apart. So I kind of didn't know where the business was going to end up as well. So we put that on hold for a couple of months, just to let things play out. 

I was in a joint venture with that as well, and I just went to my joint venture partner and said, 'Mate, I think we're just gonna have to put a pause on it for the moment. We'll get it settled and we'll do a little bit of the background. But I just really need to focus on business at the moment.' And he was really good about that and understood [that], because that was funding the project, so had to make sure that was rock-solid and keep [that] moving through this COVID-19 time. That was just really unprecedented times. 

So we got through that, and obviously, the market kicked on really well, which was really beneficial for us; [we] got a lot of capital growth out of that. [We] ended up doing a one to two subdivision there, and then we built two houses. 

Tyrone Shum:   

Oh, wow. 

Nick Hague:  

Sold those ones off the plan in a really good time as well. It ended up being a really good project, but at the start, it could have gone either way. I think you just have to deal with what I call speed bumps in life; you just have to deal with the speed bump one at a time. [It's] best to talk through it with someone, especially like a JV [joint venture] partner. I think it's best just to have that conversation early, communicate early, so they know what you're thinking and make sure you're on the same page. 

Tyrone Shum:  

Yeah, totally. And as you said, it could have gone wrong if you panicked. COVID was really causing a lot of things to go havoc, and you could have just said, 'Let's just put in the market, sell, and then just cut the losses.' But obviously, you guys did very well by holding on. I think that's the thing, it's just having that patience because things ride out. If you wait for it, it gets better, which is what happened. 

Nick Hague:    

Exactly mate, and I think that's why I really like property as well. I like going in with those small subdivisions or something with a few different exit strategies. That way, you know, we could have still just subdivided and sold the land off if we had to or reduced some debt by selling one block. 

Tyrone Shum:  

Yep. 

Nick Hague:     

I really like projects with multiple exit strategies, they appeal to me for that reason. 

Tyrone Shum:  

Absolutely. I think that's so important with any deal that you do. It's not just [about] the subdivision, but any deal; you've got to have clear exit strategies. Otherwise, if you get stuck and you don't know what you're clearly going to be doing, then you're kind of—you've got to figure it out very quickly. You don't want to make that wrong decision and [incur] those losses because there's always a way out; it [just depends] when and how. 

Nick Hague:    

Exactly, and talking to people in your network that might have been through that situation before, or just have one little idea. Like you said, you picked up a few different golden nuggets from Steve [McKnight’s] event. You might hear one little thing, just a little bit differently, that you know you sleep on that night. Your subconscious works over the night for you, [and] you wake up in the morning like, 'Ah, let's try this'. I think everything works out, and you just have to wait for that solution to present itself. 

Tyrone Shum:  

To fully relish the triumphs, one must extract wisdom from the setbacks—a lesson Hague has learned through his journey. Reflecting on one such moment, he recalls venturing into a property investment in Gladstone amid mining activities, experiencing initial success that eventually took a downward turn. 

Nick Hague: 

It was actually referring back to Steve McKnight; I used to go to a lot of his property updates when they were in Brisbane. He used to do them fairly regularly. 

Tyrone Shum:   

He still does it now. He did it in Sydney actually; that was why I wanted to go because he gave that property update. Then straight after that he was flying off to Brisbane to do his next update.

Nick Hague:    

It was sold out. I was meant to go to it on Sunday, but it's sold out. I've been speaking to a few people that went, so I'm kind of getting the gist of it. 

Tyrone Shum:    

I can tell after this. 

Nick Hague:     

Sweet sounds good. He just had a lot of integrity, honesty, and I really liked going down to those events. [He] never tries to sell you anything; he just seems like a good human, and the people that he attracts are also the same breed, I suppose. They just want the same thing—know what was going on. They wanted an honest person that could help them with that process and to figure out all the data, and Steve was that guy. 

At one of his events, he said that some mining things were going on in Gladstone and regional cities. So I jumped on a plane probably the next day, I think, after hearing that and I went to Gladstone and bought a property up. 

Tyrone Shum: 

Just like that. 

Nick Hague:   

[I also had] cousins living up there, so I kind of knew the area a little bit because I stayed up there on holidays when we were younger with my auntie and uncle. I jumped on a plane, stayed with my cousin for a couple of nights, and made a couple of agents up there. They drove me around, we went and looked at a few properties, and I ended up putting two under contract. One ended up falling through, which I'm pretty thankful for now, but [the other] one I ended up picking up which was a duplex, a little concrete bunker I used to call it, the ugliest thing in the street. It ended up strata titling that, making them into two separate units. 

Tyrone Shum: 

Great. 

Nick Hague:    

With the potential to sell one off and pay some debt down, [things were] going really well. [However], I might have gotten a little bit greedy [as I] saw it go off. The rents went up quite substantially, and they came down quite substantially as well in a very quick space of time. The lesson learned from that was that 'out of sight, out of mind' [strategy] for me wasn't probably [something] I was good at, keeping an eye on the market when I had so much other stuff going on. In those towns and places, you really have to keep an eye on the market fairly closely, especially if you're not living there.

Tyrone Shum:  

Hague delves into the reasoning behind his decision to venture into this unconventional property investment. 

Nick Hague:    

A lot of coal seam gas was going on in the mining [sector] up there, as well as in the shipping. I thought, 'I know Gladsome, I've been there a couple times; that felt comfortable for me.' I guess it was just taking the action, which he instilled as well. He seemed to think it was a good spot, so I did some numbers myself, went up, and had a look. I could see the maths; it was definitely moving. 

I guess there's a few good lessons in that. One was I took action; I went and did it, and I lived and learned from it. The next one is I won't be investing in another city anytime soon. 

Tyrone Shum:   

Lesson learned. 

Nick Hague:    

I guess if I did, it would make sure someone's on the ground or make sure I've got someone there [who] can let me know what's going on or keep a closer eye on it. Not having the business stress or pressures anymore, I could probably do that myself as well. 

Tyrone Shum:    

So, you basically managed this whole property and you managed the strata tiling, everything you did yourself, and didn't actually get any people on the ground to do it for you. 

Nick Hague:     

No, I didn't actually. But I had a good agent up there and then ended up finding good tradespeople and [others] to help me as well. So that was really handy. The managing agent was awesome up there; she helped me with some renovations along the way, which was really quite handy. I don't think I've been offered that service before by the way she project managed that little renovation that we did up there on the property. 

Just a little bit of an unfortunate event [as well]. When we had the property, obviously, the property market went up, the rents went up, and then [they] started coming back down. So vacancy rates went right up [too]. 

It was really hard to rent the property out. We had to drop our rents consistently to just get tenants in there; the quality of tenants kind of went down as well. Then we had a tenant pass away in one of the units, so just to top everything off, which is a really sad event. But it just added fuel to the fire, and I [thought], 'This just can't get any worse.' But anyway, we live and learn, and we're here today. Those unfortunate things can happen, but you kind of just [treat it as] another speed bump, you kind of have to deal with it [these things] as they come up. 

Tyrone Shum:    

Yeah, it sounded like an amazing story initially: a great property, rising rents, strata-titled, and I'm [thinking], 'Yes, this is excellent.' Then next thing you are saying, 'Oh, rent has dropped'. 

Did you guys break even, or did you make a loss on that particular property?

Nick Hague:  

I made about $100 000 loss. 

Tyrone Shum:   

Oh, ouch. 

Nick Hague:    

It's in a trust, so we can carry it forward and use those losses up at some point, which we're already potentially using them up as we speak. It's good and bad. We've done a lot of projects that have made us money, so to have one go that way is definitely a lesson learned. I'll definitely think twice before investing in a city outside of Brisbane or outside of my comfort zone, I guess. 

Stay tuned for what’s coming up after the break where Hague unveils the thrilling reasons behind his exciting journey into the dynamic world of property development … 

Nick Hague:  

I think the electrical business had run its course, and it definitely served its purpose. I was definitely looking for a change.

The thrill and joy he derives from his role as a business developer manager… 

Nick Hague:  

So it's kind of like life is my playground. [Being] out of the office is good, meeting people is really [enjoyable]. 

The self-imposed plans and goals of his commitment to continual growth across various facets of life… 

Nick Hague:  

I really just want to keep learning and growing—as a dad, as a husband, as a leader, as a developer—in any way I can in helping people. 

And that’s next. I’m Tyrone Shum and you’re listening to Property Investory.

Tyrone Shum:  

In a reflective moment, Hague shares his pivotal ‘aha moment’ cultivated over the course of his property journey. 

Nick Hague:      

Just the connections that I've made over the years in property; the people that I've met. I enjoy doing projects with people as well, balancing skill sets. I don't have all the skills set under the sun, so [being] able to bring other personality types and skill sets to a project excites me as well. Seeing other people succeed really excites me; I generally like to help people. But as far as aha moments, I'm not really sure, to be honest. I generally like the property business, like being around property, [and] like improving properties as well.

Tyrone Shum:    

That is a pretty good 'aha' moment, to be honest. Just to understand and know, because a lot of people still don't get it, unfortunately. Sometimes, when you put property together, you have to actually have a team around you. And that's your natural billion, that's like, wow, you know, I can do it and make it successful. So yeah, I think that's a good 'aha' moment for you anyway. 

Nick Hague:   

I'll take that. I'll [also] take your advice and definitely write that and keep that for future reference, mate. So thank you.

Tyrone Shum:    

Hague attributes his transition from his electrical business to the property development sector to his desire for a new lifestyle at his age, highlighting the pivotal role of mindset, strategic planning, and the alignment of circumstances in his transformative journey. 

Nick Hague:   

I think the electrical business had run its course, and it definitely served its purpose. I was definitely looking for a change, and [one that would allow me to] keep the lifestyle for my family to a level where we were comfortable. 

It wasn't a decision that was taken lightly; it happened over a few years. It was a plan that was put in place probably three or four years before it happened. I'm not a huge planner, but I'm glad I planned for succession to happen and for [indiscernible] view. 

It probably did happen a few years before I thought it was going to happen. But I guess everything does happen at the right time. So I was really grateful; everything kind of fell into place.

I think it's just part of the mindset too—you think it's going to happen, and you work towards it, and all of a sudden, pieces of the puzzle just fall into place. I was very fortunate; the right person came along at the right time, [entering] the business [as I] exited the business to go into another business as well. I think, you know, hard work, tenacity, persistence, determination, courage—I had to pull on all my strengths to get that to happen. 

Tyrone Shum:   

So out of all the businesses that you could have gone to or the type of work that you want, why finance? Because you could have just said, 'I'm happy with everything, I could probably run a development business in the background'. 

Nick Hague:    

I was doing my developments and really liked who I was dealing with at the time. I got to know the business owner, Matt Punter, quite well in that time. I liked how he worked, his way of thinking, and his way of running a business. I [thought], 'I could work with this guy,' and I didn't think I could go to work for anyone after running my own business for so long. It would have to be [someone] I could get along with, [someone who] knows my style of work as well. I really like to take ownership of whatever I'm doing, so to give me that freedom to [indiscernible] my knowledge from the last seventeen years as well. 

Tyrone Shum:     

Hague shares his current role in business development at Punters Finance, emphasising the joy of being out in the field, and connecting with people and assisting developers in various situations. 

Nick Hague:  

Being in business development, I get to talk to a lot of people. Each day I'm out on the road, not stuck in an office; [it's] like being stuck in a classroom back in the day [and I prefer] to be at the playground. So it's kind of like life is my playground. [Being] out of the office is good, meeting people is really [enjoyable]. Joining the dots for who needs what, helping developers in different situations—whether they need finance [or] trades, [or want to be] part of our team that can potentially help them [navigate] through a situation—that's what I really enjoyed doing. 

That's a big part of why Punters [Finance] is based on it as well—they like to help people succeed, and they do that through their finance business. It was an ethos that I really liked and could definitely grab hold of and run with. I'm here today, and I'm really enjoying my time. The people up here are awesome. Just seeing [it] from a back-end point of view, rather than just a client perspective, it really rings true to how I saw their business as well.

Tyrone Shum:  

Excellent. I think that's the key thing [when] you're looking to work with somebody. It's always possible to work successfully within the business because you've been given that autonomy and being able to run [your own] business successfully, people usually prefer that from someone [else]. At least that way, you got that umbrella to be able to work with someone who you can also get along really well with. It sounds like Matt and yourself work really well together.

Nick Hague:    

Yeah, for sure. Definitely. Yeah we just really enjoy it, mate. I'm really thankful for the opportunity that Matt's given me and have definitely grabbed it with both hands, and I’m trying to kick some serious goals up here. So yeah, watch this space.

Tyrone Shum:   

In a reflective turn about his past decisions, Hague imparts the advice he would have given himself from 10 years ago, expressing a desire to have placed greater emphasis on acquiring and holding properties for longer terms. 

Nick Hague:      

Don't buy property in Gladstone. I've thought about this recently and spoken to a lot of people as I have approached that 40 [age] mark. I think the way you think changes over time as you get older. I've definitely have thought recently that I would definitely hold more property. We've developed and sold a lot of property over time, but to keep one or two of those along the way would have been really good. I wish younger Nick was thinking [for] future Nick. 

But anyway, we're here now, and we can definitely start that journey now. So I guess that's my next five to 10 years— definitely to get some more buy and holds under the belt, especially in southeast Queensland. I'm pretty bullish about southeast Queensland at the moment, so [it's] definitely a good time to buy and hold and get some good yield.

Tyrone Shum:    

Yeah, and you know Queensland well enough, so that's the reason why—because it's an opportunity compared to the other states. Things are still going around the cycle at the moment. What's been interesting is the stats coming through, saying that each month, particularly from CoreLogic, both in Sydney, prices have been going up steadily. This is really interesting to see what's happening because [there's] so much media hype that things are going backwards, but it's been the opposite—lack of supply, huge demand. Yeah, so we'll see what happens. 

Nick Hague:      

Exactly. I'm talking to agents and buyer's agents every day of the week, so I'm really on the ground with that. Staying up with the market really closely definitely helps with the developing side of things as well because you're hearing it firsthand. You don't need to hear it from the news; you don't need to hear the whole fear factor from journalists and things like that. You're actually on the ground, living and breathing it every day. And I think that's really beneficial.

Tyrone Shum:   

Hague expresses his enthusiasm for the future, emphasising his commitment to continuous learning and personal growth. 

Nick Hague:    

I just want to keep learning. I'm reading a lot of books at the moment. I wasn't a big avid reader, but I have definitely picked it up in the last 18 months. I really just want to keep learning and growing—as a dad, as a husband, as a leader, as a developer—in any way I can in helping people. I really just want to keep improving myself, to be honest. 

I picture myself like a lobster. It has to keep growing, and as it grows, its hard shell gets removed, so it becomes really vulnerable. But then, as it learns and grows again, the shell kind of grows over it, making it a bit harder again. So it's a bit of a weird analogy, but just to learn and grow, learn and grow, learn and grow. 

Tyrone Shum:   

I like that analogy. I've never heard it before, but this is the first so it's always good for the first.

Nick Hague:    

There you go. I am the lobster. 

Tyrone Shum:    

Yeah, your lobster analogy, that's great. 

Tyrone Shum:    

Well Nick, you've achieved a lot and you're very successful in your own right. How much do you think your success has been because of work skill, intelligence, and intelligence, and how much of it do you think has been due to luck?

Nick Hague:     

I don't know if I believe in luck, so to speak, but I definitely think everyone has their own form of intelligence, so they can grasp onto their own intelligence as well. I [believe that], combined [with] hard work and determination, these three or four things can definitely [help you] create your own luck. And I think that's what I've done over time —little by little, I've created my own luck [with the] opportunities that have come across my path. 

Tyrone Shum:     

So you're saying that you create your own luck?

Nick Hague:     

I think so, yeah. Skill, hard work, and a little bit of intelligence, which we've all got—it's having that drive, and eventually, luck's got to come your way, right? 

Tyrone Shum:    

But I think that's the key one—that we always create our own luck, and I have belief in that. The more that you do, the luckier you become.

Nick Hague:   

That's right. And surround yourself with good people. 

Thank you to Nick Hague, our guest on this episode of Property Investory.