Plus, hear about the other big motivator—aside from financial freedom—on why she has dedicated her life to the pursuit of property and why and how she bought a boat with a beer!

Timestamps:
25:08 | Combining Their Talents in Gosford
27:10 | Central Coast Strategies
00:27 | Put Your Tools Down
02:15 | A Boatload of Experiences
06:49 | No Laugh Track Necessary
08:43 | More than Financial Freedom
10:21 | Trial and Error
14:21 | Fitting Learning into Her Lifestyle

Resources and Links:

[00:04:19] So that's also been an interesting purchase because it comes down as well when you get homes that are not habitable. It does affect the valuations a lot. So when you're going through your loan, you've got to really think about, 'Okay, the condition of the house is not habitable. So how much extra deposit or funds do I have to put into this property to be able to settle it?'

This is Property Investory where we talk to successful property investors to find out more about their stories, mindset and strategies.

I’m Tyrone Shum and in this episode we’re back with Laura Nasr, the lifelong property fan who turned her childhood hobby into a fulfilling career. The director of Christian Bel Real Estate shares the importance of buying under the right structure for you, her unconventional mentors who may not even realise their impact, and why and how she bought a boat with a beer.

Having bought two investment properties in Western Sydney, Nasr and her now-husband made their first purchase together in Gosford. With her real estate expertise and her husband’s career as a builder, the property they bought couldn’t have been suited to a better pair of buyers.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:25:08] Basically, it was like you couldn't live in it. So we did a lot of improvements, a lot of maintenance, we added an additional room. So our strategy changed from just buying a under market property to okay, we want something that's development zoned with a residential house. That way, we can find tenants a lot easier. 

  

[00:25:40] And then under the original footprint, there has to be potential to add an extra room, or an extra bathroom. That way, we don't have to go to council and get all the approvals. 

 

[00:25:54] So with this industrial property, we turned it from a three bedroom to a four bedroom. So originally, when we bought it, it was a three bedroom, one bath, one car, and we changed it to a four bedroom, two bath, still one car. So we used that strategy to then get a higher bank valuation to then go on and purchase the other properties.

Tyrone Shum:   

They’ve put that strategy on hold for now, but that doesn’t mean their overall goal has wavered.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:26:46] Ours is more like a 10 or 20 year goal for particular sites. And we usually buy in areas that haven't taken off just yet. So once more of the infrastructure and development goes in and around that, then that's the time that will develop, not when it's kind of like the first in the best development in that pocket. We'd rather hold on and wait until everything else has come up.

Tyrone Shum:   

[00:27:10] Fantastic. And since then, have you purchased more properties like those? Is that been sort of the strategy that you've gone down that path?

Laura Nasr:   

[00:27:19] So after that property, we bought a little R3 development site on the Central Coast. We were really lucky because that one had already two dwellings on there. So the income was quite good. Again, [it] wasn't livable, [it] needed a whole lot of maintenance, a whole lot of improvements. 

  

[00:27:35] We did it all ourselves. I did a lot of that pregnant with my first daughter. So it probably went a little bit slower than what we expected. But we did that, again, we've left it there until the market picks up. But as it stands, you can put townhouses on it. 

 

[00:27:54] After that, we've gone on and purchased within two hours of Sydney. We've got a business zoned development site of three amalgamated homes together, we have a unit site. And all of these have residential homes that we've gone in and done improvements on to then borrow against and buy the next one. So we try and pay down the debt as much as we can. So we can get that redraw to buy something else.

Tyrone Shum:   

Many people find it difficult to locate sites with development potential and execute their plans, but not Nasr.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:28:50] So we always look at properties that have the uplift and development potential. Areas to add an additional room is a big one, like we've bought two bedroom homes before and made them three bedrooms under the same footprint. 

  

[00:29:04] And that really increases when you get your bank valuation. And it increases the rent as well. And it's basically really easy for us to do, we just put in, like, a gyprock wall. As long as you've got a window, you've got good ventilation, it's fine. 

  

[00:29:20] So yeah, we've had a lot of fun doing it, we love it. And we're really fortunate that all the properties that we have, we've been able to visit ourselves and experience the area before we purchased it. And a lot of them are in adjoining already growth suburbs. So we're trying to buy below market in a suburb that's already priced lower than what everything else surrounding it is.

Tyrone Shum:   

While her property journey has been relatively smooth so far, there’s been one bump in the road that many investors are familiar with.

Laura Nasr:  

[00:00:27] I think during COVID was a big time where... I mentioned my husband's a builder. There was a lot of difficulties with building and that small time where everyone had to lock up their sites and work and all the rest of it. 

  

[00:00:44] And then, at that period of time, I had just had my son, and so I was off working. And I was, at that point, unemployed. And we were fortunate enough that our portfolio supported our living, basically. So that, I guess, is our aha moment. 

  

[00:01:00] And also, it gives you motivation, to say, 'Oh, my God, I just want to keep buying more, because it has sort of allowed us to continue living', and also continue buying, which we've been really lucky to be able to continue that journey as well.

Tyrone Shum:   

After noticing an opportunity to expand their portfolio, Nasr and her husband headed north.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:02:15] So we did buy a majority of our homes within two hours of Sydney, but we also see the opportunity in Queensland with the Olympics and all the rest of it. So we ended up buying quite a number of properties 20 minutes from Brisbane city, and one of them being on quite large land and the owner was a hoarder and all the rest of it. 

 

[00:02:33] Part of the negotiations was we'll give him his price if he leaves— he was really into boats and all the rest of it. And he had this old catamaran sitting right at the back of the block, which probably has no value to anyone but my cousin's a boat builder. So we could see the opportunity in that. So that came into the negotiation. 

 

[00:02:57] So basically, we got all excited, we got this old catamaran, obviously it's got holes, and it's got a lot of work that has to be done. But that was a really big part of it and trying to come up with the value of what we want to pay for his house. And then also what we think the value of this catamaran that doesn't work is. And we bought that property. It was a for sale by owner. So there was no agent involved. So it was a funny experience.

Tyrone Shum:   

With emotions at play when it comes to dealing with owners rather than agents, they found they needed to change their tactics.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:03:44] I think my husband went and took him out for a beer and that maybe got him over the line.

  

[00:03:53] He had a couple of big dogs, so they could relate on the German Shepherd level or whatever it was. So just building rapport. 

  

[00:04:03] So we bought a lot of very interesting properties. We're renovating one at the moment, which is 80% that there was a fire there. So we have been spending a lot of time doing that. 

  

[00:04:19] So that's also been an interesting purchase because it comes down as well when you get homes that are not habitable. It does affect the valuations a lot. So when you're going through your loan, you've got to really think about, 'Okay, the condition of the house is not habitable. So how much extra deposit or funds do I have to put into this property to be able to settle it?' 

  

[00:04:45] So that's also been a learning experience, as well as the different zoned sites. So industrial, you've got to pay more of a chunk and then that reflects as well in the condition of the property that you're buying.

Tyrone Shum:   

Every investor has a different strategy. While some look for simple processes that focus on specific numbers, she targets properties from another angle.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:05:35] I think a big key thing for us recently is trying to buy up the neighbouring properties. So this burnt house neighbour's something that we already own. So it's got a different kind of value for us. And that goes the same for a few others that we own is that we are the best buyer for these types of properties. And that also comes into play with negotiation when we're talking about price and where the market's at. 

  

[00:06:06] And we do also have the skills and the knowledge around how to get around that or how to improve on those things. And through mistakes, we've learnt that some of these things require a little bit of a different strategy behind it.

Coming up after the break, she shares why she bought in a stigmatised area…

Laura Nasr:   

[00:06:49] We have one in Queensland, where we bought it at a very, very low price.

The strategy that doesn’t suit her…

Laura Nasr:   

[00:11:29] So we've learnt that that's probably not the best strategy that we want to go down for now.

She delves into how she learns all she can about property in what little spare time she has.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:14:21] I'm a mum of two kids that are 11 months apart. If I read a book at night. I'm probably asleep by the second sentence.

And that’s next. I’m Tyrone Shum and you’re listening to Property Investory.

Tyrone Shum:   

Among her tales that could have been lifted straight from a sitcom, she does have some straightforward success stories as well.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:06:49] We have one in Queensland, where we bought it at a very, very low price. Again, it was on the market for about 12 months, and it is in a more rural area, but it's opposite a Bunnings Warehouse. And again, this is zoned industrial, warehousing and so on. 

  

[00:07:10] And just clips from where the flooding is, it was slightly elevated. So when the floods happened in Queensland, and so on, there was that stigma. So we jumped on the bandwagon and bought up two of the neighbouring properties, because there wasn't a lot of activity in the market. 

 

[00:07:30] So since that sort of calmed down, and all the rest of it, we've made a good profit on those without having to actually renovate them just because of the way the market was.

Tyrone Shum:   

[00:07:42] So buying the right location, really good location, and then just the timing of the market allows you to be able to have an increase or value added. 

Laura Nasr:   

[00:07:51] And something that we always do is jump on the portholes and see what's been approved in the local area. And we try and buy up adjoining those sites, because then we can get an indicator as to where the growth will be in those suburbs, rather than just saying, 'Oh, this has got a good return, I'll go and buy that', we want to have a good return. But more importantly, we want something that we can develop on later that we're buying below market.

Tyrone Shum:   

Financial freedom is a big motivator, but it’s not the only reason Nasr has dedicated her life to the pursuit of property.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:08:43] I think because it's fun. I just... like, it's got nothing to do with, like, money, because that comes to anything that you enjoy, I think. I've always been obsessed with real estate. My husband's obsessed with real estate. I'm sure my kids will be obsessed, because that's probably in their genes. So it's a hobby, and it's fun. So whether it works or whether it doesn't work, it's still just as fun for us.

Tyrone Shum:   

As Nasr is so passionate about what she does, it quickly became second nature to her. However, her mindset plays a role as well. 

Laura Nasr:   

[00:09:28] And I think also being positive, like, we've made a lot of mistakes, and we've lost a lot of money as well. But being a bit more lighthearted about it and saying, 'You know what? It's an adventure. It's fun. How great that we can learn a lesson through a mistake and not have to learn it with more negativity around it' or whatever else it may be. We just take it as it's fun. It's light hearted. It's just real estate. It's just property, and it's what we love to do. So that's our mentality around it.

Tyrone Shum:   

One of the biggest lessons she’s learnt involves discovering what the best structures for her are, and what they aren’t. As these will differ for everybody, it’s often a trial and error process.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:10:21] I think our biggest mistake was buying a large plot of land under the wrong structure, with the banks. And I think, with the interest rates and so on at the moment, getting yourself into a loan, that's not the best. It can cost a lot of money. 

  

[00:10:21] So we do analyse who we're getting our loan with, and what the conditions are, because we've basically lost a lot in different purchases through wrong structures.  

  

[00:11:01] And that comes down to, as well, a different strategy. So we, before we got on the right track, let's say, would buy large blocks of land, and then try and package them up, and then on sell them. And that missed the mark in terms of price. And then because of the structure that we purchased those blocks, you've got to pay additional tax, and you've got to pay additional costs that are associated with that. 

  

[00:11:29] So we've learnt that that's probably not the best strategy that we want to go down for now, is flipping, we would rather buy, hold, get the income and sort of stabilise the portfolio and not develop on things straight away.

Tyrone Shum:   

With the world of property at our fingertips, mentors have come a long way from analog newspapers and magazines.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:12:48] I'm really lucky, because most of my job in real estate is with investors or developers, that's more my area of what I work in. And they're all my mentors, because they all do different types of development. And they've also become friends and mentors in a way, like, 'Oh, Laura, I wouldn't do this', or, 'This is what I'm doing and it worked well'. 

  

[00:13:12] So I take a lot of advice off people that are doing it now. And people that have made mistakes, and that are making mistakes now, because that is so valuable for me and what I do, and also it gives you great ideas of different areas to invest in.

  

[00:13:31] So my clients are my best mentors.

Tyrone Shum:   

The busy young mum recognises that reading doesn’t fit into her lifestyle right now, but that doesn’t stop her from learning all she can.

Laura Nasr:   

[00:14:21] I'm a mum of two kids that are 11 months apart. If I read a book at night. I'm probably asleep by the second sentence. I don't do a lot of that. But I do watch a lot of real estate shows, renovating shows. And I do listen to a lot of podcasts from developers. 

  

[00:14:46] Jonathan Hallinan great example of a fantastic developer who unfortunately passed away quite recently. Tim Gurner, as well, I follow and listen to a lot of their stuff.

  

[00:14:59] I guess that's kind of my new Home World. So when I was a kid, I'd love looking at the Home World in Kellyville in the western suburbs, and now I love looking and listening to these guys that are doing huge luxury developments. So yeah, I do listen to those types of podcasts.

Tyrone Shum:   

[00:15:46] If you met yourself, say, 10 years ago, what do you think you would have said to her?

Laura Nasr:   

[00:15:50] I'd just say go for it. And don't worry about making mistakes, don't worry about losing money, because I think health and happiness is way more important than that. And we're not going to have anything when we pass away. And you'll remember the fun and the good experiences and the lessons rather than anything else. So yeah, just give it a good go. And don't have any fear. Buy that property with termites.

  

[00:16:26] Have fun with it. Like, it should be a really exciting and fun process, not something to get stressed about. 

Tyrone Shum:   

[00:16:48] What are you excited about in the next five years in your property journey?

Laura Nasr:   

[00:16:54] I'm excited about finding something unique. We want to do development around medical centres and boarding houses and that kind of thing. But I would love to buy big acreage to run Airbnb, like you know how you have that picture of the bathtub on the lake and all the rest of it. I want to find that property and get into Airbnb and see how that goes and give it a try. 

  

[00:17:26] And then in five years' time, a few of our investments will be ready to develop. So we'll look at what's being done around those areas. And then we'll see what makes sense and what would be best suited for that pocket.

 

[00:17:45] And maybe invest overseas. Who knows? 

Tyrone Shum:   

[00:17:54] Well, Laura, it sounds like you and your husband have achieved a lot of success, building a portfolio, running your successful real estate, work and so forth like that. How much of that success has been because of your hard work, skill, intelligence, and how much of it has been due to luck?

Laura Nasr:   

[00:18:14] I think we're very lucky. Because I'm in real estate, my husband's a builder, so that together is a lucky combination. We've bought when the market's great. So we're lucky in that aspect. And we've bought when the market is not so great. And we've sold when the market's not great. And we've sold when the market's good. So it will probably be 50/50. 

  

[00:18:39] But we do spend a lot of time analysing. We spent a lot of time in these areas. We've never bought a property where we haven't gone to the shops, where we haven't gone to the fast food [places]. We haven't gone to the petrol station, walked around, walked in the street, get a good feel of the area. We've never ever bought a property that we haven't done that. So we have spent a lot of time researching.

Thank you to Laura Nasr, our guest on this episode of Property Investory.