And today with me I have Mohammed Kamara and he is here to talk about disparities in healthcare when it comes to people of color in communities of color. And it’s really important to talk about healthcare doing COVID-19 because we’re seeing huge disparities. Welcome, Mohamed, thank you for joining me.

Thank you for having me, Michelle.

So can you tell us why you started your company and what really led you to go and switch directions and where you’re going in your career in education to start a telehealth company?

Sure, so my sister passed away given birth. So during childbearing, she was expecting a daughter and she passed and that led me to sort of take a look Step back in my career was in healthcare, finance and valuation and then be able to provide telehealth services to populations that are look like me. So my sister passed and I suddenly became a caregiver to three of her children that she left behind. So my sophomore year I was an only father really sending money back home and taking care of their needs. And that has really helped us to focus on how can we increase access to care in communities of color? And in additionally, how can we use AI to impact racial disparities in healthcare?

 

Now, as you talk about telehealth and racial disparities, I want you to First tell me where are you from? Because I did take a different accent than the accent I have.

Sure, so I’m originally from Sierra Leone. I left my parents tree because of a civil war back in 2001. 1999 to be exact about when I left January 6 was the war happened in Sierra Leone so I left and traveled to Guinea and lived there for most a year almost almost a year lived in Senegal and northern England six months and then finally to the states. So that’s how I got my my son back to Columbus, Ohio.

 

Michele:
Okay, so now you’re here in the US you’re in college and you’re far away from home when you lose your sister. What What is that like? Because a lot of us were may not be close our family but to be hundreds of thousands of miles away. How did you first cope with that?

I think it’s a it’s much more taking a step back and then react because it has to happen really quickly. When when our parents give birth to us Usually in the African community, you are your parent’s insurance. Literally, we don’t have like life insurance. So we’re our parents insurance. And so what that means is as soon as a bad happens, you’ve got to think, Okay, what resources do I have that is financial resources, and as well as resources that I can send back home first for the burial to happen second, how do I plan to take care of whatever else you’ll be left behind and that is my message. I have three children. So those were the things that are happening very quickly in my mind. But beforehand, I was already sending money back home to my mom and to take care of ourselves. So I just just a wish my sponsor responsibilities just increased, that’s all.

Okay. So your sisters has passed on and and you’re sending money home? What are your next steps? Like how do you get from losing her to having a telehealth Company what is tell us what happens in between?

Sure. So what happens in between is I, as soon as that happened, and I had an opportunity to travel to Dominican Republic, Dominican Republic was a time I took my I spend my birthday so I took some time off of work and I spent about a week in Dominican Republic working with projects whole and while I was there, we’re providing care to a woman with the Zika virus. And so we went to a clinic in the wall area of Dr. And Dr. in about four hours out there to provide care out so I was I was in a pickup truck, had medical equipment, those pickup truck driving all the way for hours on loading that they have a community center in the in the wall area where when what they also had a classrooms or went into the community itself to provide this care. And that’s how the journey began. start researching what is the gap in healthcare that exists, why do health care board certified physicians and other medical professional goal received to provide care but there’s not a continuing conservative care? So I actually question is, how can we continue that here, right? telehealth was but what was on one option? And then it’s like how do we affect not only those people of color in that in the in the US, but as well as international? So how do you bridge the gap? Um, telehealth was a very big step to that.

Okay. So you, you leave Dr. You come back to the US What are your next steps?

My next step swore. I was in Georgia then. So I left Georgia to come to DC because it was about building team and ecosystem and you can’t do anything alone that I believe in. If you’re going to be anything successful, you need a team. So to be a good steward of the resources that you have, you’ve been blessed. With I was like, Okay, well, I’m gonna take that leap, took a big leap, come to DC and started started the building phase. I got into an accelerator program, then started doing customer discovery interviews when I met somebody who is who was wondering who is responsible of one comprehensive health care clinic in DC. So that was our first test flight. I mean to watch not technology and those type of patients were patient that were affected by the opioid epidemic. And I’m not sure if you’re familiar with the opioid epidemic, yes. And that itself, it is the type of treatments that were provided to communities of color and the opiate epidemic was some some point, especially back in the olden days, you were sent to incarceration, right? Because you’re an addict, as opposed to now where when it became it he communities or communities that are nonprofit They began to aqueous treatment centers. That’s what they should have done in the first place, but coming into the scope as well, because we do need that help. And so that’s that’s how we pulled it back. And we started finding out that it is challenging. There’s challenges that come with access to look at access, okay. And those communities, transportation is a big problem, Mom and mom and daughter, mom and daughter has mom has has two daughters, and she has to worry about daycare, and she has to worry about how can I get to care too. And so there were a lot of cancellation of appointments.

So like, Okay, why don’t we launch this telehealth work for the web app to be able to address some of those issues, the gap in access to care?

So as so now you’re testing out the telehealth, what are you seeing as far as the changes now in the number of cancellations or the the changes in the number of patients who are being treated once you’ve implemented telehealth,

so we After, after we we launched the telehealth we saw about 2500 patients and some of those patients. We also interviewed got a chance to interview them as well. One of the things that we learned from the interviewees, they were super, super busy. Some of the ways that they some of the challenges that they happen to help barrier to healthy, some of them small. So we have smokers, but we have challenges is they don’t have time. They don’t, they don’t have time to be able to come to an in person visit to see a doctor. They also they also spend most of us out there most of the time to get healthy by chasing out their kids, right. So you have to be very creative in bringing wellness to them. Where involves an entire family. So how do you plan for that? So we build our technology with them with those answers in mind that it’s the only access to care why Do a text consult, what is also the what do they need a communities I keep them accountable because that’s what our that’s what we’re hearing. So we created a piece that here you can count your steps with others and stay healthy and then rewarded for those steps. Right? So comes accountability piece. So we get we hear we heard that and then the second piece was, how do we then create a technology that’s embedded within the same platform to be able to correct BMI? Okay, and made up corrected BMI is really taking a 10 second video of yourself. And then instead of me as an African American, that was an athlete, expedition athlete, I was told always that I’m overweight bla compared to my counterparts that are that are location because of my body mass. However, this technology because it’s powered by NASA, it’s corrected that so we have a corrected BMI and virtual assessment, right. So they all know health waist, so this is This is technology that’s normal. That’s exciting and actually talk a little bit in transmission disparity.

I love it, love it correcting what is a standard for all, which was never a standard for all. There were definitely very different what I love about what what you’re doing is gamification and how and actually creating with the demographic that you serve, ways to serve Him that is inclusive to them. So Oh, well, you’re always chasing your children, you’re always doing this. How do we make it fit into your life as opposed to us trying to get you to fit into the technology?

That is one of the good thing is in the tech is it we call it a healthy tribe. So that means mom, dad, sister, coworkers all can be part of batch, batch, right? So you guys are willing to belong in that way. And then it’s like, okay, hey, My held tribe and then I was like I’m a caregiver right to my sibling, my sister siblings, and that was included as well. So if you’re a caregiver of your video, grandmother, you can all a mom right? You can actually be put down that mommy’s part of your health tribe as well. You can keep keep their health records in. So it’s like healthcare in one hand, pretty much.Got you.

Okay. That is that is absolutely fantastic. So it’s community like he’s a tribe. It takes a village, his village healthcare, that’s I was trying to get to that word, it was village, healthcare, and absolutely agree. You always see the groups of women were walking together or the groups of men talking together, like how do you get them active as a community as a group as a village, so I’m really excited about that aspect now. So now we’re in the midst of COVID-19 and you are very knowledgeable and experienced in the disparities with people of color when it comes to health care. What are you seeing being done, right? Or treatment or accessibility? And where are where does it need to be some improvement in how people of color doing COVID-19 should should be treated?

 

 
Sure. So we already know that the eggs then there are gaps in healthcare that exist. We COVID-19 we know that the system didn’t address it yet. So COVID-19 just amplify that. Just like in telehealth, it just amplifies the importance of it. And some of the systems that things that exist is access, okay. lack of proper nutrition, food, food insecurity, I exist, right? healthcare, a lack of access to health care exists. So those things that already exists, regardless of previous predisposed, predisposed, all right, meaning that because of the patient, what the conditions were, those already exist if the if the patients have good access to healthy food They will eat well. If they have good access to a hospital, they will likely go so sick here. And they have trusted physicians that actually are advocates for them. They’re going sick. Yeah, well, they don’t have that. Now, a virus happens and this virus, it’s a new, it’s a new strand that we are aware of. Right? It’s a new strand, and we’re trying to figure out how do we then contain it. If you already have disparities, lack of access of care, lack of food is food insecurity. We don’t have good we don’t have good housing, there’s usually a lack of shelter. So those conditions already exist. And with the with the virus, the virus is is human to human touch, right job LED light droplets you can get you can get it and this human human touch, it happens through so so so our brothers and sisters are may not have the perfect conditions to have access actual affordable housing that are then going to be able to get get the fibers and then take them to shelters, right? Take those without the virus or shelters and spread it, it becomes a ripple effect. And that’s, that’s some of the same things we’re seeing in New York. And so we have here Even I spoke to a coalition of ours. Dr. Christian, she, she’s a she’s a family physician, and she takes care of the underserved. So communities of color and others football, the underserved and she in turn, had to switch her practice from a traditional practice of Sinan person to telehealth very quickly. I was I was on the phone with her when this was happening, switching our patients to telehealth. So this is just as you can see more of our mobile patient virtually. But this is the things that we’re noticing that we need more apps access to care. We need better way to take care of our communities that is innovative. But it’s the virus just amplified that there’s a true need and a lack of access to care and food insecurity and affordable housing that is still affecting our communities.

Yes, it’s interesting, not interesting. But you talked about food deserts and our lack of access to food and what that looks like and everybody I’m in rural South Carolina right now truly thinks that food deserts a lack of access to food is only an urban issue and it’s not it is very, very popular also in rural areas having access. So as well as housing, right housing that anybody want to live in, but actually have access to decent housing is very important.

Now I want to go into

And if I may add, that those those things we call in health care, social determinants of health, right? Those are the things that are that besides just taking care of your well being. Those are all the factors that influence health. And even as of last week, two days ago, I had a I had a friend who texted me she sent me an email, he texted me as well and call me twice that hey, my sister is in our sister lives in Georgia. My sister is in Georgia, right? And she’s been affected by COVID-19. So she’s a COVID-19 patient, she needs access to care. So this is when we and I literally had to do the manual way away going off platform figuring out this well actually actually calling a doctor question to give me a recommendation on very good providers are in health that is out in Atlanta, right. And so now she’s she has a primary care physicians. that’s taken care of her. Well, those that’s the reality that You can have you can have a cover nice efficient like that and don’t have a issue she didn’t have insurance I’m just like how do we then increase get her the care that she needed while rapidly

and that’s that’s where I was going so right now we’re in the midst of COVID-19 Have you seen more practices from reaching out to you saying hey we need to be able to help our patients we need to be able to help people impacted who are not our patients with without insurance. How do we work with you? What What do you tell them?

 

Yeah, so that’s I get those calls daily now. I don’t know if that’s a blessing in disguise. But literally, I had a call like that I as I explained, I was like, Hey, I’m going to walk with you guys. We call this I call the clinicians go on the app find out find out this clinician is mobile in the area book an appointment with them. Um, we had a we have adult Rab doctors in an hour from now. I’m basis physician that are retired physicians, but there, they also wanted to still make an impact in the community. They live in Virginia. So they called me last week and said, hey, how do we get louder we get access to telehealth and be able to see more of our patients out of retirement, right. And so I’m having a conversation with them and showing them how the platform works, how I can onboard them, right. So this is what COVID-19 is showing that people want to make a difference, no matter where they retire, they want to come out of retirement to really make a change. And I’m just here as a people on the tool to be able to support them.

Absolutely love it. I love the ability for people, us to be able to sue or you to be able to provide and provide services and be the bridge between healthcare providers and patients who actually need it, especially right now doing COVID-19. Now, and

just highlight that the Virginia that then they that’s a position that’s efficient, the pictures This position and an OB GYN and they’re not then they have their Caucasian as well. So it’s not just computers are full of ethic, that feeling of the page, although users well they fill in the page.

So so that was going to, you know, you’re bridging the gap. So now are you seeing even more physicians who do not serve communities, underserved communities coming to you, and be needing to be able to to provide services to their, their patients?

I’m seeing more of it. Um, because I think we have, we have to have things that happen in healthcare. One is physicians that have compassion for communities of color. And then we have advocates as well, right? You can even on color and then be an advocate and surely walk into those environments. And I mean, I have access to those sorts of combinations. And disclude it’s just as also wonderful as well because they’re when then when when we’re not at the table about the table to be Out voice right advocate, not influenced but advocate because the advocate means actually they want to do the fight with us. Um, so they’re there. They’re coming to me pediatricians, infectious disease physician, ob gyn, they’re coming to me to be able to get them on the platform. So I’m seeing an increase of that as well. So not only serving our communities, communities of color, but they’re also serving their communities as well. So it’s deep and deep.

Great. Okay, so let’s talk more about, we talked about the platform, the app, onboarding people, let’s talk about artificial intelligence, the AI behind us, what does that what does the AI do?

So really, it’s really cool. I think it’s an exciting technology because in 10, second, literally a 10 second video of you, you can get a virtual assessment and part of that virtual assessment includes your BMI your your health waist, and it’s collected BMI. So as a technologist powered by NASA, it has NASA all good In a machine learning that really in those 10 second upload here in this feedback, a virtual assessment of view of what you truly are, regardless of if you are male or female with body mass, you’re not overweight, it’s actually a corrected while your virtual estimates really should be not just because based on other other factors that are traditional factors. So that that’s an exciting, exciting piece. And I think we recently learned in Brooklyn and that UnitedHealthcare got in trouble because over the AI that proposed supposedly that that that was showing racial disparities, right, and they’re in trouble for that and trying to clean up that mess, keeping keeping minorities or callers from getting the care that they need.

Yeah, if the bias is built in from the beginning, it spreads all through whatever is being it is being utilized for so you have to Go in. And that’s a huge talk discussion going on. Whether it’s bias against women and or people of color that’s built in. And the feedback is, well, we had women on the team is like, if you thought to be inclusive of whoever’s on the team, you would go out at least start talking to people to understand those different intersectionalities of how to do it. And even LGBTQ is getting left out right now, when it comes to COVID-19. So

and Michelle, you gotta take it further than that, right? It’s not just been having a sit on a table have been left out. It’s about a person, the developers, the programmers, right, the product managers, because they have the hind side to create and when they create, if they only quit, because of the what looks like them. The sample size that they that they that they have, that is male is sample size from certain only a certain segment of certain communities, then it’s going to influence how the how the technology response, right? Like you have to create a large sample size that that’s more inclusive in nature.

Yeah. And And generally, a lot of places go, Well, we want to target the largest population and sometimes this, that’s not the best way to go, depending on how who has the most needs and who’s going to buy first. But one of the other things is in health tech devices, sometimes they will make things for, let’s say, the male heart first. So if a woman has the same condition, she cannot get the same treatment, because the device is too large, because usually women’s hearts are smaller than men’s hearts. So you see it over and over again. It’s like, Oh, well, it’s a male condition, but women have it too. So it definitely like you said, it’s more for thought about who’s being served. Now, let’s let’s talk about COVID-19 five years from now, at five years after COVID-19 Where do you foresee telehealth and your your company being? Five years? COVID-19? And also what policy changes do you see in healthcare?

So, that’s a great question. And there, we have experts there. So my background is I’m an economist, right? So there are experts that that have put out data out there that did win four or five phases of, of the corn COVID-19. Phase One is the phase one is we identify it exists. Phase Two is containment. And phase three is developing some solution on their vaccine, for example, and the widespread of it, right, forcing it into certain communities. Hopefully, it’s not, it’s just everybody’s gonna be able to try it out. I’m not just certain communities. So that’s Those are the phases of how we see this COVID-19 taking place. The old, the old theory, although the thing is just like a cold, a flu, it’s isn’t a light, so it may come back to so we have to keep that in mind. And this kind of led to, hey, we’ve because of COVID-19 we’ve seen why it’s so increasingly important to pay attention to health care workers and support them right. And as well, how do you support them, you support them to have a demand stable, creating technologies that help them so my goal I’m just a partner with enough Caswell partner tool providers, we are partners to patients and we’re making sure that what true health creates true healthcare is a relationship is relationship medicine, right? That’s true healthcare. It’s between the patient and a provider. We’re just connecting the dots for them. So fast forward from now is weird. need to have it policies in place. And now because of COVID-19. Some of the policies I’ve kind of been drilled down a bit around reimbursement around credentialing. When I say credentialing that means can a provider be able to see someone that is in Ohio, even though they may not have a Ohio license, right? Those those things need to continue to be inflated costs COVID-19. And reimbursement is I am going as a clinician, if I’m a doctor, I’m Senior virtually and we’re having a conversation. Right now. I’m going to be paid the same amount as I will be paid in person, right. Usually that is not acknowledged is not the case in telehealth. So we those policies need to be in place and change to be effective for five years from now. telehealth does exist. Well, now we’ve seen the increased importance for you.

Yes, absolutely. Agree. definitely definitely have have some policy changes. Because you have states that have fewer doctors than others for these, but they can’t service them even in telehealth, you have it close to disparity, you still have huge disparity. So yeah, so licensing is definitely a big issue. If we can’t, at least at least we do neighboring states, something to help help along that process. How can people find you who want to either find a clinician in their area or maybe their clinician looking to provide their services during COVID-19 or post COVID-19.

 

So we’re on the Android arm and we’re also on iOS releasing iOS versions as well. So we’re gonna be on iOS two so we can be found on the App Store. You can reach out to me directly contact us at info If kids calm, that’s our email. I will also host a podcast to the empowered patient podcast, which is released on a weekly basis. And we bring in clinicians who are experts in different fields and different specialties and talk with them and also technologists as well and intrapreneurs. So it’s really a safe environment to be able to learn things about healthcare. Yeah, that affects you on a daily basis. We talked recently to a clinician who is an NP and is affected by COVID-19. And we noticed that because of COVID-19, there’s an increased demand for care, right? So the old patients that already have chronic diseases, they’re not even coming into the office all day that it’s like, there’s glitches to take care of those patients. They also have to take care of COVID-19 patients and so there’s an overburden of them. That’s the reason why it’s so so important. And for all it’s really useful also bridge that gap between By here via tag. So we can be found in Oh, and third, another another source of founders is, in August of this year, July, August, there’ll be a release of the book called empower patients, which is the name of the podcast in their power podcast. They publish a podcast so the book will be released and will the book really just tells you about things you can do as far as wellness is concerned. And also bringing in a coma in a way that we some of the patients that we saw, that were affected medic opiate epidemic, bringing in those patients experience so that you can actually relate to them and feel inspired. So that book is coming out here in July.

 

So just to get this straight, you can go to the website, you can go to the app store, you can go to podcasts, and if you want some great reading August, you will have the book to it. Okay, so Yeah, I would guess yeah you’re on social media too.

Oh yeah, yeah we are so we are now at um so I in Ovi care as you know, cares. We’re on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter and ice. So any social media platform where there were philosophize? The The, the podcast is concerned when it platforms podcast platforms and also you can listen to the podcast on our website too. So we have a section there we have one blog section today you can be able to look look at resources that pretend to you about wellness.

Well, Mohammed, thank you so much for joining us. We as a world right is not a country is not a state or city as the we’re all going through this together as we all combat COVID-19 I commend the work that you and your company are doing with telehealth to close the gap for people who needs health care services, whether they have the virus, or they have other medical needs, because it’s truly, truly needed not only now but it’s needed in communities that are aren’t often served.

So thank you for joining me and everybody. I hope you have a great day and we will talk to you later.