Property Podcast
How To Stop Overthinking and Grow Your Portfolio With Jill McIntyre
February 10, 2021
Jill McIntyre is a life, business, and property coach who has experienced personal tragedy and now teaches others how to overcome mental barriers to purchasing property. Powering on through living with hearing loss and then the loss of her husband, McIntyre rose to the occasion and made herself a success in property and in coaching others.
Join us in this episode of Property Investory as we talk through the barriers many people face along their property journey. We also discuss dilemmas such as whether it’s a good idea to involve friends or family in business deals, and hear McIntyre’s thoughts on honing in on one suburb v. 10, how creating a mind map can both calm and motivate you, and whether it’s realistic to commit to working on your goals seven days a week.

Timestamps:
00:42 | Sometimes We’re Not Ready
06:01 | Life is Hard, Pandemic or Not
10:58 | Pick Your Entry Price Point
12:59 | Become an Expert in a Suburb
16:22 | The Art of Planning
21:30 | Holding Yourself Accountable is Key
23:57 | Be Realistic, Don’t Overcommit
26:36 | Find Money Partners, But Not at Home

Resources and Links:

Transcript:
[00:09:32] I do a lot of work with clients who are coming into deals with no money. And this is where I started all those years ago. And even now, if I go into deals, I don't have money in the deal. It's my expertise, my time, my skill bringing the team together that allows me to have a good input into the deal but also a good percentage of the deal as well, through what I'm doing.

**INTRO MUSIC**

Tyrone Shum:
This is Property Investory where we talk to successful property investors to find out more about their stories, mindset and strategies.
 
I’m Tyrone Shum and we are back on another episode of Mindset Monday with life, and property coach Jill McIntyre. Dealing with the loss of her husband and starting a new life as a single mother of two, we learn how she helps others to achieve their personal and professional goals, how to overcome investing stoppers and her thoughts on zeroing in on one suburb.

**END INTRO MUSIC**
 
**START BACKGROUND MUSIC**

Tyrone Shum:  
McIntyre describes how she came up with the topic of property stoppers, and where the idea came from.

Jill McIntyre:   
[00:00:17] When I was thinking about what to speak about... I go back and I've been coaching for many, many years, and I was even doing property before I started my life coaching course and my property and my business course. So there's been lots of things going back. I think back in 2002 I started in property. So it goes back a long time. 

Sometimes We’re Not Ready
 
[00:00:42] And a lot of this also, Tyrone, I can relate, apart from my own clients and where they're coming from. I certainly remember when I was coming into property I was very green, absolutely green. I left in self esteem, self worth, all of the sorts of things, petrified to be speaking up in front of people let alone be on a podcast like this now, or doing a Zoom session. I was in an interview the other day for a couple of hours. 
 
[00:01:10] I was completely the opposite to the person that I am these days. And so a lot of the things that I hear— I've just had a client before I've spoken to you— and within the first five minutes, she's wanting to get into property. She's had a principal place of residence, but she's now at the age of 50. And she said, 'I should have been talking to you 15 years ago'. 

[00:01:36] But sometimes, Tyrone, we're not ready to do things. And when we’re ready, we will step up. But interestingly enough, I could hear of all of the things that she's done over the last six weeks or so, it's been amazing. But then every now and again, she dropped something that would tell me that, in her mind, she doesn't believe that it's really happening. On a physical sense, she's doing it. She's doing all of the trackwork that she needs to do to define an area, doing all of the legwork, getting out, meeting new people, going to networking groups, doing all the right things. 

[00:02:16] But the problem is that in her mind, she kept on saying to me, 'yes, but I won't be ready to buy until well into next year. We'll start with March, Jill. I won't be ready to buy until March'. And so I turned around and said, 'What's your biggest stopper?'. And what I'm sharing with you today, she is so typical of so many people that are in property, getting into property, even people who had done one or two deals, but they lose their mojo when they've got to start at the base roots again and find another deal that stacks up, let alone a money partner. 

[00:02:54] So a lot of what I'm sharing with you today comes from how I felt all of those years ago getting into property. Obviously with a hearing problem. I didn't even know the lingo around property, let alone I knew it was going to be my vehicle to move forward on. But I didn't realise as much as I do as time has gone on that my main driver isn't property, my main driver is my thinking, and what motivates me to move forward.

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:03:25] Yeah, it's the mindset behind what we do. And even when I was just talking to Young just a moment ago, before our call, we talked a lot about mindset. A lot of things that we do hold us back because of what we see and what we think between our two ears. And if that doesn't change, things don't change. So it's just fascinating. We as observers from the outside, we see there is that stop up. But internally, when we actually talk to ourselves, we don't think it is because we justify and go 'Why should we do it that way?'. It's fascinating what you've just told me about your client, saying that she's holding back until March. What’s the reasoning behind it? What's the stopper that's causing her to think like that?

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:04:10] Well, the problem is that we doubt our own ability. We doubt our own worth. I've done in previous Mindset Mondays, talked about fear. And instantly, it's that little voice in our head that comes up and tells us 'Well, who are you to be buying a property? Nothing else has worked in the past, people are gonna laugh at you'. And so we overthink a situation. 

[00:04:36] And if there's problems coming up within our mind, we as human beings absolutely hone in on problems. And we spend too much time regurgitating our problems rather than thinking and flipping our thinking over to a situation of 'well if that's the problem, what's the solution?'. Because once we can click our thinking over into a solution mode, we lighten the books in our backpack on our back for a start. But also, we raise our level of consciousness which we need to be in a state that has really proactive, motivational imagination. It's inspiring. It's where we really stoked our fire in our belly. We need to be in that state more, to achieve. And it's so important.

Tyrone Shum:   
[00:05:29] It is. Why do you think we drift towards the negative mindset, instead of actually just positive? Because it's so hard for us to go, 'think positively'. That's why we even have positive affirmations, we have to try to motivate ourselves. But when there's negative news or something that's wrong, it's so easy just to spiral into it, and then just go, 'yep, let's just talk about this negative problem'. It's almost like gossip, it's like the best thing ever, we can keep going on and on about it. But when it talks about positivity, it's just so hard to start.

Life is Hard, Pandemic or Not

Jill McIntyre:   
[00:06:01] It's hard. Life's hard at times. And, of course, experiencing COVID is just the perfect example. Before we started interviewing, you and I were having a chat about what was happening in the Melbourne market, and just coming out of COVID along the way for so many people, and we're in uncertain times. But at the same stage, it's also brought on for many, many people, a lot of positive stuff. 

[00:06:30] And we've been confronted with how to think differently and what to think differently about. And so unless we're pressured into these sorts of situations at times, we won't go there. We stay in our comfort zone, we keep on doing the same thing every day, going to work, doing the same things, the same outcomes. And we don't grow. And COVID, for one reason or another, has made a lot of us think 'well, how can I find a solution to this?' There's an old saying, 'We don't grow alone. We go with and through other people'. And this is so, so important to have mentoring, you've got mentors that you work with, Tyrone. There's people that inspire you. I do too. Doesn't matter who we are, we always need to be looking up to other people and taking what we can in their growth, their strategies, their beliefs, their ideas. 

[00:07:35] This is why real deals are so, so good. On meetup groups, or you talking on your podcast with people as they work through their deals. It's other people's mistakes and the ins and outs of the things that haven't gone to plan that are the greatest learning curves for every one of us. What we might do is to hear things, but do we take them on board? And sometimes the timing mightn't be right. But other times, we've got to stop and think, 'hey, I've been playing this treadmill game for the last five years, and I'm no further advanced. What am I going to do about it?' But it's only when you're ready to pull your sleeves up and take action that things actually change in your life. Would you agree with me there?

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:08:21] Yeah. And I was gonna say exactly that. I reflect back and I go, 'sometimes I'm just running on the treadmill, because I know I've just got to get these things done'. But lately, I've been taking a step back and thinking, 'what is it that's really important in my life? What is it that will actually achieve the best result? The one thing that's actually going to drive and leverage the most?' 
 
[00:08:41] Because I've been extremely busy lately, and I've been going 'okay, what actually has actually driven the most revenue into the business, but also, too, what has helped me grow to a stage where I'm happy, I'm comfortable, and there's enough there?'. And I think that's exactly right. It's that once you're on a treadmill, you don't actually take a step back to go, 'Okay, what is it there?'. Because you can just keep running and running and running, running, you'll never stop until you just stop. So I think it's perfect timing to actually talk about this right now. Because it really resonates with me, and I love how you've actually said, 'Okay, let's think about it and ask what are the stoppers'. So maybe let's talk about what are the stoppers that are in property that people commonly come across?

Jill McIntyre: 
[00:09:29] Well, it's quite funny. I have a lot of people, I do a lot of work with clients who are coming into deals with no money. And this is where I started all those years ago. And even now, if I go into deals, I don't have money in the deal. It's my expertise, my time, my skill bringing the team together that allows me to have a good input into the deal but also a good percentage of the deal as well, through what I'm doing.

[00:10:01] It's quite funny that the number of people that I speak to who are coming into a deal and wanting to get into property, and they've either run out of money, that they've borrowed up to their capacity, but usually, that through the ups and downs, they haven't got borrowing capacity behind them, and they're needing to use other people's money. And the biggest point that in our subconscious level, what we do is consciously. If you haven't got money, on a conscious level, you will be saying to yourself, 'right, I'm going out, and I'm going to identify where I'm going to start to look', and this is so, so important, identifying your area. But at the same stage, that little voice in your head is just overriding what you're doing and telling you, 'you haven't got the money, so why bother?' And that's our stopper.

Pick Your Entry Price Point

[00:10:58] And so the biggest thing is that if you're going into a deal, and you haven't got the money to go into a deal, I would always suggest— even if you do have the money— is to identify a price point of what you're going to be looking at. So it might be a median house price of say, $400,000, depending where you are, $600,000, $800,000. Obviously, you're in Melbourne, Sydney prices, or if you're in country prices, or even in Queensland prices is a lot cheaper than a lot of the Melbourne prices. 

[00:11:33] So pick your entry point, override the thought that you don't know where to start. And that is your starting point. Then go around and— I just go into the Sunday paper, it's as easy as that, into the options for the day— and look up all of the price points of the area that I'm wanting to get into. Even the childcare centre that I got into. That's how I started and found Frankston South where I eventually went ahead and set up the team and did all of that with the childcare centre that others involved with me now with that one. 

[00:12:10] So start with a price point. And there in that price point, you might have 10 different suburbs that you're looking at, with that median price point. What you need to do, if I came and time and time again, even my client this morning, when in our session a couple of weeks ago, I said to her right, were you looking at me to find the area that she was looking. But she said to me today, my problem is that I've heard other people presenting and seeing and real deals, and they've been working in other suburbs. And so I've moved to that suburb. Where someone else has said something that's detrimental about the suburb that I was planning on working in, and that you can't find deals there. So I've moved away. 
 
Become an Expert in a Suburb

[00:12:59] So in other words, all she's been doing is to be to jump from one bright, shiny object to another, which is a suburb. One bright, shiny suburb to another. And she's accomplished nothing. You need to define. Yes, you might start off with a median price over about 10 suburbs. But then you start to work on how far from home do I want that suburb to be? What's the demographics, transport, these sorts of things, what's going to motivate people to move there? And then I start to be refining my search of 10 suburbs, down to five, down to three, down to two, down to one. 

[00:13:42] And start to be honing in on one suburb because it is so, so important for people to become an area expert in that one suburb. All the work that you need to do in one suburb is finding out supply, demand, days on the market, building relationships with agents. Finding out what the actual potential purchaser from your product of whatever your strategy would be if it was a buy, reno or sell or buy, reno, subdivide, sell. What would your potential purchaser of your buy reno sell be looking for? And start to be thinking ahead of what you want. And interesting enough from this lady when we were honing in on her going to all of the bright shiny suburbs and then coming back. She said, I've come back to the suburbs where I originally started. She said, 'I've done the whole circle'. 

Tyrone Shum: 
[00:14:44] It's like that story of diamond in the rough where the people could go search for finding something outside of it. But in actual fact, it's in their backyard.

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:14:52] Yeah. And I just said to her... she said someone said something detrimental about that particular area that she was wanting to look into first of all. And said, you won't find anything there. So she moved away from that and I said, well, 'That's the problem in their mind. What if you flip it over to thinking, "wow, I haven't got as much competition in this suburb. And I'm not going to have to fight off other potential people". Because if they think like that person did, this is my market'. And there's money to be made in every market, Tyrone, well and truly. So that just flipped her negative thinking over into, 'wow, what have I got to do next? What's my next plan of attack?'

**ADVERTISEMENT**

Tyrone Shum:
Coming up in the second half, we discuss the importance of planning ahead and keeping organised.

Jill McIntyre:
[00:18:07] But it's also true—the clincher— when I'm reading his preliminary assessment is that he doesn't write things down. And then he's wondering why he's suffering from stress and overload. If you don't write things down, how much can you take on board with clarity and focus and clearness?

Tyrone Shum:
We go into more detail on how these skills translate into confidence.

Jill McIntyre:
[00:23:17] But every day, if you keep on doing it, you will certainly gain the confidence that will override the fear of how am I going to sell my deal, or how am I going to move forward with this one. 

Tyrone Shum:
McIntyre goes into how to find the right money partner, and who not to choose. 

Jill McIntyre:
[00:28:51] 'What's the solution here? How can I find money? Where can I find money?'. Obviously there's many, many people that you can find money from that could be investors.


Tyrone Shum: 
And that’s coming up next. I’m Tyrone Shum and you’re listening to Property Investory.

**END ADVERTISEMENT**

Tyrone Shum:
McIntyre offers insight into how to find the momentum to achieve your goals, starting with a weekly plan.

The Art of Planning

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:016:22] I think we all have at one stage or another. But I think if I look at my clients or clients over time, I think the biggest thing of really achieving is to set a plan ahead, a week ahead, a month ahead. So if you're wanting to purchase a property is to do something like a six month plan, or a three month plan, and then bring it back into if you're going to have purchased a property or want to acquire a property a good deal and getting money partners and things like that. Bring it back to the two months, for one month, what do you need to achieve and then work from the beginning over your projected month ahead. Next week, what do I need to have achieved by Thursday of next week, and the week after, and start planning. It's interesting. I've got a taste test, a one off session that I had with the taste testers that I had as part of my package. And the gentleman I'm talking to this afternoon, I've received his preliminary assessments. And it's like a mirror, it's going to be weird talking to him, because it's like a mirror of me and of where I was 20 years ago. And all of the things that are happening. He's done lots of property. There's no doubts about that. But none of them have made a lot of money either. 

[00:17:58] And so he's come, because he believes in his mind that most of it is between his ears that's stopping him. And it is. But it's also true—the clincher— when I'm reading his preliminary assessment is that he doesn't write things down. And then he's wondering why he's suffering from stress and overload. If you don't write things down, how much can you take on board with clarity and focus and clearness? If it's continually regurgitating in your brain, no structure or follow through on black and white that you can really look at an action plan or a whiteboard and know what you've got to achieve the next week? It's a formula for self sabotage. 

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:18:51] I was gonna say, then you basically have a lot of things just bubbling in your head the whole time causing you more stress because you're not knowing which clear direction. Because I find if I don't write things down, I start to feel overwhelmed. And I guess once you've actually put down the things you can clearly see on paper, visually, what's going on in your head and half the times the things that you're talking about or thinking about your head might not even be relevant.

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:19:15] Oh, absolutely. And that's where the tentacles keep on bringing more and more of our fears in, too. It's funny that you should say overwhelmed because when you're working without a roadmap or a mind map or whatever you want to call it, a timeline, all of the similar sorts of things to me, or an action plan. If you're working without that, you're only leaving yourself open to vulnerability and to certainly exhaustion, frustration, where you're gonna have the same conversation with yourself 12 months down the track and still be beating yourself up, why you didn't achieve. But how can you achieve if you're not sending clear signals to your thinking, into your mind? If you're confused and stressed out, what sort of signals are you sending to upstairs? You're going around in a circle.

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:20:13] Yeah, that's right.

Jill McIntyre: 
[00:20:16] Absolutely, yeah. So my thinking is that everything you do is very much... write it down, work a plan that might just start. Some people might need other people to brainstorm with them, Tyrone. Even from what we're talking about today, I'm sure as people are listening they'll go off and start to jot down some notes. If they don't, I'm sure they'll start to jot them down rather than keeping them in their head. 

[00:20:44] The other thing is, that's a good one, is that you can pick up your phone and just use the recorder on your phone if you can't write it that time, so that you've got them later on. And you don't lose that thought. And then come back and work on it within a time, within a 24 hour period, because if we don't use it, we will lose it again. And it's all about action and follow through.

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:21:09] It's so true. Yeah. I was gonna say as well, too. How do you think people can be accountable to these things as well, too, because it's easy for us just to go, 'Okay, this is what we're planning to do'. But how do we make change, substantial change, to show through accountability?

Holding Yourself Accountable is Key

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:21:30] Well, if you can't make a firm commitment to yourself, and honour yourself, because you're your greatest asset, there's no doubts about that. But the trouble is, we give ourselves too much leeway. Or I might get up and feel that I've got a sore throat coming on or I've got a presentation I've got to do so I won't do what I need to be doing. Because other things have overwritten it. And then I've lost the momentum on what I really need to do as a bigger picture. 

[00:22:01] So there's a couple of ways that we can work around this. You need to keep yourself accountable. Now, if you can't keep yourself accountable, and if by that, I would be saying, if you're wanting to move forward and go into property, for example, don't set yourself the task of saying, I've got to work on property seven days a week. I would like to think that. And— again, this client this morning, because she's achieved so much on property know-how over the last couple of weeks that I've spoken to her, because she said religiously— I've been putting in and doing something. And she's a single mum with three grown boys that live at home. So she's got a full household. And she said, 'what my number one focus is every night, six out of seven days of the week, I at least do something in property'. 
 
[00:23:01] You could just get on and start looking at sites, you could get on and look at sale comparisons, you could get on, and on Saturdays, on Friday, listing all of the opens, and doing little bits that mightn't take you very long to do. But every day, if you keep on doing it, you will certainly gain the confidence that will override the fear of how am I going to sell my deal, or how am I going to move forward with this one. 

[00:23:31] The other thing that I would suggest, Tyrone, that if you're going to do and set a plan for yourself, don't commit to seven days a week. Commit to five days a week. Give yourself a couple of days of flexibility. And you were saying earlier, how you've been looking at how you needed to change things because you've come to that point in home, and work, and gross, and property and things that you're doing. 

Be Realistic, Don’t Overcommit

[00:23:57] So allow yourself a couple of days leeway. And then that doesn't allow you to fall behind. It allows you that if you want to do it and day six and seven, go for it. Or if you want to say yes, I can only do it a couple of times a week, but if I could tune in for an hour overall on a couple of times a week, that would be fine. Or you might say I'm going to give 15 minutes a day by five days a week. Doesn't matter how you do it. But once again, set your game plan in action and keep yourself accountable. 

[00:24:31] Now, if you've got trouble keeping yourself accountable, you need to be working with a buddy or someone else that's on the same train as what you are that's like minded. But not someone that's going to allow you to chicken out continuously, but is going to push your buttons, yes, going to raise your bar, yes, without it being aggressive. I'm not talking about that. But someone is on a motivational growth bar. Or otherwise, start and work with a mentor. 

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:25:04] I like the buddy system, that works really well. But you know, to find that buddy system, it can't be just a friend, because your friend might not be interested in this type of thing.

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:25:12] You have to choose your friends well!

Tyrone Shum:   
[00:25:14] You have to choose your friends well, exactly, because they've got to be both accountable. And if they're also on the same journey, they can be accountable to you as well, too. So there's benefits of both actually doing that kind of system as well.

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:25:27] Well, the other thing is me is if you go to a meetup group, for example, and networking, and you're looking to find out more about property, or you're looking for someone to do a JV with or you're just starting at the bottom—that's a good situation where a lot of people can be on the same thought path, motivation wise what you are. But I've spoken in earlier Mindset Mondays about being able to choose the right person, that person has to be on the same level of thinking, I'm not talking about coming from same personalities, because quite often, if you're working in a little group, opposites in personalities can work extremely well, because one will come with a very different thinking to the other. But what you do need to be aligned with is that you've got the common goal of commitment, of accountability, of input into what you're doing. So that one out of the two of you isn't doing all of the work and the other one's on the shirttails. So picking the right person that you want to work with is important.

Find Money Partners, But Not at Home

Tyrone Shum:  
[00:26:36] Absolutely. It is so, so crucial. So Jill, what are, for example, other stoppers that people come across that stopped them from really, really achieving their potential and success in property?

Jill McIntyre:  
[00:26:49] I've got no money. That's a big one. And I've got no money. And as I said earlier, automatically, you might want to be on a conscious level coming in yes, I'm going to look at property and, and Jill said to do this and this and this and you go out and do it. But all the way, this overwhelming fear is coming in and talking in your head about 'who are you?', and it tries to talk you down. Your ego tries to hold you in abeyance and tries to stop you. 

[00:27:24] So we've all got ego, regardless of where we are. Obviously ones like Donald Trump have got a lot more than their fair share. And even as a quieter personality, our ego comes out with a little voice in our head. And when I became aware of ego, I certainly started to think about, 'yep, I can hear the stoppers that are coming up', and that little voice telling me 'Who are you to be going out and finding money partners? Who's going to listen to you?'. 

[00:27:56] And these are all, a lot of them with childhood things, that through trying to grow and not have strong self worth and self belief in yourself, turning that round and taking it on board as an adult. And thinking, 'This is my journey. It's not someone else's journey. Just watch this space'. Or I'd turn around when I knew that there was stuff coming up for me. I turned around and look at it as if it was close my eyes and look, this was in my mind's eye and a physical thing in front of me and say, your use by date's expired. 

[00:28:35] Now I'm very good at saying your use by date's expired ticket, because the more and more I did it, it became an automatic thing of totally killing off something that was negative. And then flipping my mind into 'What's the solution here? How can I find money? Where can I find money?'. Obviously there's many, many people that you can find money from that could be investors. And one of them I would stay away from family or best friends. 

[00:29:11] Because quite often, that can be the end of friendships or break up a family. I'm not saying all the time, but I would reach beyond that to start off with, if that makes sense. I would go to meetup groups. And I would work on getting into groups and talking and communicating. It's very much about building rapport. You can't just walk up to someone and say, 'Yes, I'm here. I want money partners and you fit the bill'. It's about building rapport. Depending on personalities, where you fit in with the person you're talking to is about.
 
[00:29:48] But I always find when I'm walking up to people and starting conversations and say yeah, we haven't met before. My name's Jill. Yep, you're here at a property. Great. Where are you starting at? Are you starting at the bottom end of property, or if you've got some good deals under your belt? And just start the conversation flowing. And build into, I'm here tonight, I'm looking for some money partners. My focus is looking at buy reno subdivides sells, and you're just building a relationship with those people. 

[00:30:22] Now, they might not have money, but they might have good borrowing capacity. So it's about asking deeper questions. The other thing about can't find money partners— you've got to know your suburb. Because once you are an area expert, you will be confident with coming up with any questions that will be asked about that suburb, about its growth, about its supply, about its demand, about who the market is. And you can undo this and put in to one particular suburb, not cover 10 of them when you haven't done a lot of this before. 

[00:31:03] So being able to sell yourself with confidence is important here when you're looking for money partners. And meetup groups is an excellent way to do it or any form of groups to do it. Or Facebook. Property Groups is a good one. And you could even put it out if your money if your deal stacks up 20% profit or thereabouts coming in, you've had your numbers checked by someone else, you know the area. Put it up and just advertise on that. Or ask for money partners. Melbourne area, I need money partners to formulate a deal. 20% profit. Get in touch. And that's all you need to say.

**OUTRO**

Tyrone Shum:
To further delve into Jill McIntyre’s insights and tips, we will keep the conversation going in a future episode of Property Investory. We will discuss more property stoppers...

Jill McIntyre:
[00:00:31] Well, we can all tell ourselves we've got no time. But we've all got the same 24 hours in a day. So how come it works for some, and not for others? 

Tyrone Shum:
We’ll hear about identifying your strengths and weaknesses...

Jill McIntyre:
[00:04:03] So identify what your strengths are. It could be that you are handy, or a tradie, that you could get into a deal that could be the sweat equity.

Tyrone Shum:
We discuss how you can never be too young to flip your thinking.

Jill McIntyre:
[00:12:43] And trying to even educate her, at seven years of age, to flip her thinking about what doesn't work, and the frustration that she gets out of not being able to read and do things, to work on how we can turn it into a fun situation, rather than a heavy duty situation. 

Tyrone Shum:
And that’s next time in a future episode of Property Investory.