Debonee speaks with Phil Foster and Elizabeth Katona to learn more about their upcoming (and ongoing) group, "Presence and Silence". Assuring beginning spiritual partitioners about the 'comfort of being uncomfortable' and what it means to understand nothing (no-thing), they inspire us to be present even in these current times. You'll be reminded of the connection between compassion and suffering, radical acceptance and the inevitability of being bitten in the butt by Shadow. And of course, Phil's terrific Marge Simpson impersonation is delicious.